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chinook35

Wind Turbines on Lake Ontario!

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I also put a link to this page on my facebook page & started a group for comments on fb - Feel free to join this group: Wind Turbines On Lake Ontario - NO

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I don't live in NY, but I go to Oswego every year the week before Labor Day with my father every year.

I look forward to that trip every year and have a blast bagging 30lb kings. We go up with a series of several other boats from NH.

I have forwarded all this information to them to also have them followup with state senators to inform them of the impact of this to tourism. Between the 10 boats that go up- 3 guys per boat- figure average of $1000 a guy for the 7-10 days up there... There is $30k in lost revenue from just one group and 1 port at 1 week...

If they do this- I don't think they are thinking about the impact to sport fishing in the area at all....

Well - one good thing- if they sharpen the blades and put them close to the waterline, when the asian carp make it to ontario- they can control the population with the one's that jump out of the water...

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Sent a copy of Tom's letter to Senator Maziarz, Hope it gets some attention.. District 62 covers Orleans and Niagara Counties.

Mark

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I sent copies to all the Senators along the Lake Coast with signatures from around here who fish Ontario, but we do not vote for your Senators. I sent copies to our district Senators and to the Senate Committee by both email and postal. I think if there can be a patition at the LOTSA flee market in February along with Toms letter it will send a message from the many at one time. Just a thought. However everyone should continue to hammer these guys with emails every single week.

Howie

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How is it that NYPA or the state government can have a say in what they will propose in the waters of Lake Ontario. Last time I checked these waters are also the same waters that border another country. Logic would have it that if the construction of these wind mills and the resultant dredging and demolition to install the footers for these structures is going to liberate the pollutants that have been covered by years of more pure sediments, and then be stirred into the natural flow around the lake...umm wouldn't Canada be affected by this activity?

I would be very afraid of messing up international waters without informing the neighbors that there might be some arsenic and mercury, pcbs, etc. showing up in the water processing and supply for 1000's of communities around the lake...anybody want a drink from the lake water supply after this? Hello Canada?....do you want this?...if not then wake up and have a say if you will. Thanks

Mark

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There are many sections in the RFP that put the burden of environmental review on the proposers nit the NYSPA.

" Permitting and Licensing Plan – Provide following details of Respondent’s proposed Permitting and Licensing Plan:

a. A listing of all environmental, regulatory and other agency/municipal permits, approvals and certifications required for construction and operation of the Project(s) and the proposed schedule for securing each of the foregoing.

b. A listing of environmental studies likely to be conducted in support of the environmental impact assessment application process.

c. Identify the lead agency for the New York State SEQRA Process (Note – (i) the Authority will not take a lead agency role in this project; and (ii) a PPA will not be executed by the Authority until the Project has successfully completed the required environmental review and secured the requisite findings and consents) ."

We have to make sure whomever submits a proposal will know there are many flaming hoops to jump through to get a project like this approved.

This is some info about the review process.

http://www.dec.ny.gov/permits/357.html

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I asked a few guys today about it and same thing very little known.And I was working on a house on the lake. Some one need s to get on the local news channels & make a presentation of the facts to the public. Long line is the smartest of us and should be the one to do it . His facts on the matter could be the difference . Rohrback wants us to break away from NYC so this could be a good argument for him to use if he is really serious about it. Maybe he could be in on it. Don't wait .

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Im suprised I have seen no lawn signs in oppsition to the wind farm. Makes me believe no one knows about this. A few signs along the lake and Im sure there would be outrage for this.

I did see the commercial for saving the golden cresent last night on YNN (rochester channel 14).

If anybody knows a sign maker who is a avid user of the lake, let them know.

No signage along the lakeshore properties could be because nobody is there this time of the year. I know along our beach road, of the 75 homes, only 3 or 4 are occupied year round. This type of stuff happens every year. It's like these politicians plan to do these things when they know nobody is around to oppose the projects. Our town tried to sneak something by our association last winter because nobody was there in the middle of January to oppose it, but thanks to one of the year-rounders, the word got out and the proposed project was cut off at the pass. Politicians are sneaky and will find any way possible to get things by us without us ever knowing about it.

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My response to the D&C Editorial on Friday:

Shame on the proponents of wind turbines on Lake Ontario for not researching the limnology of the lake.

The Rochester Embayment that the NYPA is targeting for turbines stretches from the Genesee River to Braddock’s’ to Pultneyville and is all mud & sand. It is classified by the US EPA as an impaired Class B Area of Concern. Dredging is restricted to run-off only as the sediments are heavily contaminated with heavy metals, phosphorous and algae. That’s why there are year round health advisories and we have beach closings during the summer.

Excavation for transmission lines and turbines, that are much larger than their land based cousins, will liberate pollutants in the underlying sediments and the natural currents of Lake Ontario will carry them past Sodus, Fair Haven, Oswego, the Salmon River, Henderson and into the Thousand Islands.

US Executive Order 13340 declared the Great Lakes a national treasure and a $7 billion/yr Sportfishing industry has developed due to the Federal, States and Canadian governments’ restoration of native species. Many communities along the shore depend upon fishing/tourism for economic survival. Look how popular boating & fishing has become locally out of Irondequoit Bay & the Genesee River.

Transmission lines will be more disruptive to freshwater fish & aquatic life than other wildlife. The US Army Corps of Engineers is trying to prevent migration of the Asian Carp into the Great Lakes with electricity. Lines will fragment the habitat. The ecology is frail enough without underwater transmission lines.

Turbines creating jobs is also bogus. Lowville just lost their state status for Empire Zoning because the state says they’re a “shirt-changer.†Additionally Lewis County is going to receive less than 25% of what was promised from the windfarm for their 2010 budget.

Proponents of windfarms on Lake Ontario talk a good story but don’t realize how valuable the dwindling supply of the worlds freshwater is becoming during this era of climate change. Offshore windfarms on Lake Ontario are a major ecological mistake and it will be tragic if we let power companies, that weren’t allowed rights to Long Island Sound, pillage the treasures of Western and Upstate New York.

Tom Bishop

Rochester NY

Let's see if they have the [email protected] to print it. Feel free to copy paste any/all of it in letters to your local papers.

If any of you can find links to specific plans i.e. " The XYZ construction copany will install XXX turbines in YYY FOW off ABC county for XXX money", PLEASE post them.

Tom B.

(LongLine)

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longline,

That is a great letter. I hope it gets published. I think we are in for a long hard battle with the NYSPA , the push for green energy is gaining momentum and there will be a lot of misinformation published to get this travesty pushed into law. Politicians from the Gov on down are getting behind this rush for alternative energy. We may have to put our money where our mouths are ,and hire lawyers to fight our battle.

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I would be very afraid of messing up international waters without informing the neighbors that there might be some arsenic and mercury, pcbs, etc. showing up in the water processing and supply for 1000's of communities around the lake...anybody want a drink from the lake water supply after this? Hello Canada?....do you want this?...if not then wake up and have a say if you will. Thanks

Mark

Mark, as an Ontarian resident who has been fighting our government over this for three years, I can assure you, Ontario does not care about the ecological damage done by massive industrial wind turbines. Our politicians are scared silly to say anything negative against these symbols of all "green and good". They KNOW they are disturbing sensitive wildlife areas and simply don't care. This is about big money and votes, not the environment. We've been screaming at the top of our lungs over here...to no avail.

Right now, 41 citizen groups have banded together in every area of the province: http://windconcernsontario.org

This is an international assault on our waters, rural areas and wildlife habitat. People on both sides of the border need to become educated and see what is really happening here. Scientists need to start speaking up and countering the propoganda of the wind industry.

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Thanks Moe, Well, all I can say is, that in the name of going green, we are going to see red in the losses of the quality and value of life in more ways that are the most detrimental to our environment. They seem not to care about the impact of the other damages done by their efforts to go green. Kind of reminds me of the guy who would overlook the dime on the ground to pick up the nickel. I amazes me to no end, that there are so many politicians who would rather succumb to what money dictates, than to stand for what the masses of citizens want who hired them. It is with a sad heart I admit that there are changes going on that seem as though we have no control over and let a few misguided individuals "dictate" to the rest of us what we are going to have , or, have not in our pursuits of happiness. These windmills are obtrusive, in all their forms anywhere they are. They take a large footprint on the earth, are not efficient, and still have to be backed up by the same generation plants that they are supposed to replace. So what the heck do we do? The humans we put in office of the government don't listen to us, look what they did to the people who went to town meetings on healthcare in the US, who wanted more answers. These few in office are like dictators now and ram their silly ideas down our throats, and we are supposed to like it. They think that the government is broke here in NY...wait till everyone has moved out of the upstate area and then they have no tax base left.

Mark

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Here is an interesting paper on the cost of Offshore Wind power vs Onshore. Skip all the formulas and go to the bottom of the paper where it compares a land based wind farm made up of 1.5 MW generators to a Shallow water wind farm made up of 3 MW generators and it shows the cost doubles for the off shore project. We are talking deep water wind farms which would add to the cost.

http://www.nrel.gov/wind/pdfs/40566.pdf

I am not anti windpower in general but it has to be a logical part of the grid and close to cost effective. I can't see how off shore wind farms on Ontario can be feasible.

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Yes, an interesting article. The Europeans have admitted the cost from offshore turbines is much greater than onshore, but that doesn’t seem to deter NYPA as they obviously figure us taxpayers have all kinds of money to give them.

I found it interesting that the article uses costs from mounting towers on steel pilings, yet current offshore farms off Denmark use huge concrete bases. (see previous posted video for how they are really constructed.)

The NYPA request for proposal excludes water deeper than 150 ft.

It’s very sad that the Governor and his Public Service Commission and the NYPA have not included energy efficiency nor conservation in their electric energy strategies.

Tom B.

(LongLine)

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Why is it that upstate must carry the burden of all downstates problems! NUCLEAR PLANTS(including a new one proposed for nine mile) GARBAGE DUMPS, AND NOW WIND FARMS!!! From what ive seen of wind turbines they are not cost effective due to the upkeep and downtime of these. I look at the new ones at the mouth of the saint lawrence(which are very obtrusive) and notice only about a third of them are working at any given time! We need to come together as a whole and stand up for our lake and our community! Please send your congressman a letter of disapproval and voice your concerns!

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I cant stress how important it is to write our officials on this issue! What strikes me as a little scary is that I just recieved an email from an ELOSTA representative and they knew nothing about it. Also just spent the weekend deer hunting with a captain friend of mine from the western end and he really hadnt heard much about it! Seems WE need to get the word out! I am hoping Tim will chime in with LOTSA's reaction to this as it needs to happen now and not later and in a major way!! I would say this issue is the biggest to come down the pike in quit some time and needs to be addressed immediately.

Thanks for all your efforts!

Brian

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We need a lot more than a letter gentelmen .A huge dose of public outrage is in order here. Somthing on the line of the town hall meetings for health care to get some exposure of the facts that I bet most don't know. These same polititians pushed a health care vote a 1 pm on a sunday to get it passed. Did you see the buyoffs for that? So don't tell me the same is not going on here. Now is the time.

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I agree, Has Been. These politicians will do anything they can to get this passed, including, like you mentioned, having a 1pm meeting on a Sunday. As a property owner along Mexico Bay for many, many years, I have gotten used to "expecting" something to come up during the late fall & winter months. For years, the politicians have tried to do their "big" stuff during those times. Why? Because there is nobody at the lake to oppose it. Thankfully, I have neighbors who live in Oswego during the winter who are able to keep an ear to happenings. But, it is rediculous we should even have to worry things will happen to our properties and lifestyles while we aren't there to voice our opinions. This garbage has to stop!!

I live 4.5 hours away from the lake, but am more than willing to take a day off from work to drive up there to voice my opinions on this disaster-to-be. I have been writing emails a lot and have been getting responses from the representatives in Oswego County. Sure they are tired of seeing my email address in their inbox, but I'm going to keep it up.

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So boy's what we going to do about it? Talk is cheap. Heed Elvis's advice "little less conversation, little more action. "

I like the idea of a petition at the LOTSA show to start with. The letter that Tom wrote up could be copied with lines added for signatures & addresses. ;)

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So boy's what we going to do about it? Talk is cheap. Heed Elvis's advice "little less conversation, little more action. "

I like the idea of a petition at the LOTSA show to start with. The letter that Tom wrote up could be copied with lines added for signatures & addresses. ;)

I like that idea, as well, to get started. Perhaps, also, for those who live up around the lake, in your spare time, maybe stop in the tackle shops and businesses which are still open (like Woody's, All Seasons, Fat Nancy's, etc) and mention this to them. Be interesting to see if they even know what is going on. Sure they can get the word out to all the customers which come through, then those customers will tell their friends, and those friends will tell their friends, etc, etc.

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