air bladder?

[fisheye007]

has anyone tried or had success with bleeding the air out of salmon and trout when deep trolling on the lake? I know its used for snapper and grouper down south.. had a couple trips last year where it seemed like the expansion of the air bladder is what caused a few of the fish we caught to die, they wanted to go but couldnt get down. If it comes down to it i wont fish if i cant remedy this problem without rigging something, any successes, advice, or thoughts on buing one of those bleeding needles?

[momay4000]

I usually squeeze the air bladder for lake trout and it seems to work, but for salmon and steelhead I've never given it a try.

In my experience, most of the fish we unsuccessfully release are just plain worn out (possibly build up of lactic acid from all the fighting) and we wind up going back to net them. Usually the salmon are just floating on the surface without much movement, whereas the lake trout are usually flopping a bit and just can't go down b/c they're too bouyant from a full air bladder.

I've never tried an air bleeding needle.

- Chris

[rolmops]

In Lake Michigan there have been a few tests with radio tagged salmon and it turned out that salmon sometimes go from 40 or 50 foot to 450 foot down and then come up again within 2 minutes or less.It seems that the air bladder adjusts itself very quickly.

[salmonboy41]

yea the best thing you can do if you want to release them is to not net them, use say grips to land them and try to get them back into the water as fast as possible.

[fisheye007]

yeah we dont touch them salmon boy, we unhook with pliers at the side of the boat, no net, still happened several times, these fish would try to swim down get several feet then float back up, they all had the energy to swim and revive themselves but couldnt get away from the surface.

[Capt Vince Pierleoni]

Certainly can respect your wanting them to survive when released. I don't have any experience with the needles, but rolmops is correct. Pacific Salmon have air bladders that adjust very quickly. I have found that the single biggest factor as to how well they survive after release is the time of year. Cold water Spring fish do the best when released. You will notice how they fight all the way to the boat, as most of the water temp is ideal for them. By June, the the lake is beginning to warm rapidly. All Summer, Salmon will fight to the death in that warm upper layer after being hooked down in cooler water. This is particularly true with larger fish. The fish you wish to release should be brought in as quickly as possible and flipped off in the water. Any of the ones you have to bring onboard should be plunged head first back in to the water.

It has been my experience that Salmon, Browns, and Lakers release fairly well throughout the season, but in the heat of Summer the larger Salmon and Steelhead do not release very easily. If you are going to stick to your guns, do most of your fishing in the Spring and try not to "over play" any of the fish you wish to release.

I think the only species where that needle may increase survival is with Lake trout, and then only if they don't go down right away.

[Has Been]

Your experince speaks for itself Capt. Vince. Thanks for the great info. Would that mean that a released dying salmon would eventualy sink on release if he was floundering?

[Capt Vince Pierleoni]

It's always going to be a judgement call. I do remember being in the situation many of the guys are in on here. Fortunately now most of my clients are highly interested in eating at least some fish. This makes it easy to lean the way of not wasting.

From all the info I have gathered, biologists I have talked to, and observations I have made, any profuse bleeding from the gills or tongue area results in death every time. Think "lung shot". They may sink, but to no avail. The exhausted ones may float or sink. If they float, they are still likely to recover and dive. We know this from countless times of circling back for nothing. A big problem with any fish that recovers at the surface is gulls will dive on them and peck their eyes out. We have circled before just to try to scare the gulls away.

If your boat allows it safely, large exhausted Salmon can often be revived by slowly towing them behind with a boga. You will know when they are ready as they will try to rip it free of your hand! Use the lanyard on your wrist. Just be careful that the boga is gripping out near the outer jaw, and not in the gills. The river guys know that whipped Salmon can be cradled until ready to go.

From the amount of mangled but healed up jaws I am seeing on Salmon, I would say that the skill and pressure is rising, but so is successful releases.

[Has Been]

Thanks Capt Vince for the info.It amazes me how those skippers can get all 3 points of a 2/0 treble hooked in their mouths. Happy New year & good health & many tight lines to you in the coming fish year.

[Big Dave]

Plunging them works pretty good. Its not pretty , but works .

[Capt Vince Pierleoni]

Thanks Has Been. Happy New Year to all. Yeah, sure is amazing how those skippers are so efficient at getting a big lure deep!

They don't want to be skippers long! Then they move into that "sniper" 2 yr old mode, when it seems some days that they are using pliers to release the riggers and rip the divers! I often share with the clients that Steelheads and mid-size Kings will attack us in two different modes, either actively feeding or the second mode of just blasting things to stay sharp and drive us nuts!!!

[Yankee Troller]

If your boat allows it safely, large exhausted Salmon can often be revived by slowly towing them behind with a boga. You will know when they are ready as they will try to rip it free of your hand! Use the lanyard on your wrist. Just be careful that the boga is gripping out near the outer jaw, and not in the gills. The river guys know that whipped Salmon can be cradled until ready to go.

From the amount of mangled but healed up jaws I am seeing on Salmon, I would say that the skill and pressure is rising, but so is successful releases.

Did A LOT of this over the summer this year, and was amazed how a fish you would consider "spent" swam away strong. Our Berkley digital scale doesn't work anymore because of this, but it saved a lot of Kings and Steelies in dead summer. Vince is correct when he says you will know when they are ready. I watched a buddy do this and was amazed how well you could revive a fish, while still trolling, with a little time well spent.

So, I guess moral of the story is these fish can be revived successfully, and don't use a digital boga scale to do it! LOL

[Silver Fox]

If they are bleeding at all then you're done. If they are not, I will hold the salmon over the side in the water by their tail and let the water flow through their gills. They'll start moving their head and soon want to kick free.

[Has Been]

Need compartment on the side of the boat to put the fish in that the water flows thru& when he starts thrashing around, you let him out. If not, he's supper. Thanks Vince for confirming what I kind of already knew.Yes it it funny how some days you land them all & some you are lucky if it's 25%. A boga with a 6' handle would be nice.

[on the lam]

Plunging them works pretty good. Its not pretty , but works .

Agreed... the rush of water through their gill seems to jump start em' and also gets them pointed in the right direction.

We call it "torpedoing" on my boat.