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Gill-T

Cannon motor problems

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A cautionary tale regarding Cannon Mag 10 mother boards.  After blowing the mother boards on two cannon riggers from LIMITED usage of one year of fishing I thought I would post information to help others with similar problems or someone on the fence about what brand of downrigger to buy.  The specs on these motors say they can handle 15 lb weights.    Cannon is not standing behind their product as there is a $160 bill per fix.  I was told the problem was the grease used was too thick causing too much resistance and overload.  Now, it appears it to be an issue with the mother boards not being able to handle 15 lb weights.  I was told to switch to 12 lb weights........ :puke:.  For a weekend warrior I would expect a DECADE of service out of a rigger.  Frustrating..........rant over.

Edited by Gill-T

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F*#&%@^G figures. Seems all these manufacturers are cutting corners, rather than using quality parts and just raising their price. I use 12lb weights so hope I'm good to go.

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I think they have changed motors a few times starting in the early nineties (for the old mags)? I have run the original Mag 10's from the mid eighties when I bought them and they have thousands of hours on them but I have never run any weight on them over 10 lbs either which was the max. weight recommended for them. They still run just as well as the day I bought them and they don't have auto stop either I have adjusted the drag on the downriggers so that if I am busy or forget (more likely :lol: ) to get to them they just stay at the top position until I get to them. I am not a charter guy or anything so the speed factor isn't all that relevant to me I actually like the fact that the downriggers aren't high speed and the fact is that although there is "blowback" it is something I am used to adjusting for in conjunction with the display on my depth finder and some blowback will be present in most situations anyway. I'll probably incur a lot of flack for my next comment but I think a lot of the problems encountered with the newer downriggers relate to the high speed/high weight ratio which creates tremendous torque on the motor mechanisms under real time usage and the variety of weight shapes may influence this as well (e.g. some having much more resistance in the water). I'm not a mechanical engineer or anything so just an opinion to throw out there....I also wonder about how much specific time Cannon devoted to physically testing these new ones out in real life circumstances (e.g. currents, boat bouncing around etc.) I also think I would be more suspicious of the electrical /motherboard aspects. The competition is keen so they'd better get their act together as Mike suggests in the next post.

Edited by Sk8man

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Gill, I would keep a close eye on the issue as I'm sure it's painful as I know it would make me crazy as well, Cannon has to and I sure will do sômething about it if they want to stay competitive. As soon as they do I'd have the parts ready for the discussion. Most companies now a days don't like negativity out there in the field. If I hear anything and I know any other LOU member will pass info out there for ya. Hope you make out. I'd also keep asking for "who do you work for" to keep pressing for replacement.

Sent from my iPad using Lake Ontario United

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For years I had 4 cannons on the charter boat. Every year I had to send at least one to get fixed each season. 2 years ago I replaced all of them with new Scotty's, and had not one issue!!! I had enough and I will never buy or use any of their products...

Sent from my XT907 using Lake Ontario United mobile app

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I have gone through 3 boards on my probe rigger carrying a 15 lb weight. I have downsized to 13 lb for now and it seems ok. You can get a new board for around 75 bucks and do the replacement yourself to help save some coin. Still frustrating as [email protected] though

Mike

'Bout Time

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Well this explains why the two on my boat went within six months of each other. I also am a limited use heavy weight user. I only use the heavy weights out on Ontario for one week a year after that it's 8-12lbs only. I did get an STX when my probe died and Cannon offered that up for a replacement. Guess I'll be checking all the brands out if this happens again.

Thanks for posting this up.

 

Spike

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I can only hope that Cannon views LOU site. But I'm sure they could care less

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Had Cannons for more then 20 years on 3 different boats. They were Mag 10s some from late 80s some from mid 90s. Had 4 on my 24ft Lund. Had a 5th mag10 I kept around in case 1 would act up. They would have periodic problems and I was glad to find A&P Tackle in upstate NY 518-283-5920. Peter Shumann I believe is owner. The service and turnaround time from A&P was amazing. Sold the old Lund 24ft with those old riggers on it. Big ? on new to me boat for 2013 was what rigger?? After lots of thought, research and opinions I choose Scotty 2116s. Just seemed everyone that owned a Scotty was happy with 0 problems .I agree there ugly compared to Cannons.Only complaint on the 2116s is there almost to fast!! Some of my elderly fishing buddies are almost afraid of them. Probably would have been happy with 1100 series there not quite as fast i'm told.Went with 2116s so I could have option to run up to 20lb balls for those really deep kings I keep hearing about.Anyhow 2 seasons and no problems with my Scottys.

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A cautionary tale regarding Cannon Mag 10 motors.  After blowing the mother boards on two cannon riggers from LIMITED usage of one year of fishing I thought I would post information to help others with similar problems or someone on the fence about what brand of downrigger to buy.  The specs on these motors say they can handle 15 lb weights.  My understanding is the problem is widespread with motors dying.  Cannon is not standing behind their product as there is a $160 bill per fix.  I was told the problem was the grease used was too thick causing too much resistance and overload.  Now, it appears it to be    an issue with the mother boards not being able to handle 15 lb weights.  I was told to switch to 12 lb weights........ :puke:.  For a weekend warrior I would expect a DECADE of service out of a rigger.  Frustrating..........rant over.

 

This is an STX model? I ask because you say the specs are rating the rigger for a 15lb weight. Ever since the re-design they have been able to handle 20lb weights. If this is indeed the older HS rigger it's got to be 6+ years old. Is that a quote from Cannon, or Tony who repairs them in Buffalo?

 

Let's also not forget Cannon was bought by Johnson Outdoors in late 2005. They inherited some issues from the last company, and in a couple of years they totally redesigned the downrigger lineup. 

 

The new line up, which is going on 5 or 6 years now, from the 5STX to the Digi-troll have a less than 1% failure rate. We run 15lb weights 3-4 days a week on ours, and many days in the Spring/Summer a 20lb weight. We have had 1 DT blow a board in 5 seasons.

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Rick, are you replacing your riggers every year like a lot of captains? I know nothing about the difference in the motors between the Mag 10's and the STX. These were aluminum base Unitrols that I converted to electric with new Mag 10 motors. Repairs were done at Screwie Louies.

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Got to love it! I had brand new dual rigger rod holders from cannon at $250 a shot. Plastic end caps fell off due to no glue put on them. Called customer service had to pay for a $4 dollar end cap and shipping on a brand new rod holder. What bull crap I pay for thousands of dollars in riggers and don't get them given to me each year like others, and have to pay for a part a week later!

Now on the other hand I had a four year old rod holder break a weld from Great Lakes Planers (my fault) and Tony sends me a new one now that's customer service.

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This is an STX model? I ask because you say the specs are rating the rigger for a 15lb weight. Ever since the re-design they have been able to handle 20lb weights. If this is indeed the older HS rigger it's got to be 6+ years old. Is that a quote from Cannon, or Tony who repairs them in Buffalo?

 

Let's also not forget Cannon was bought by Johnson Outdoors in late 2005. They inherited some issues from the last company, and in a couple of years they totally redesigned the downrigger lineup. 

 

The new line up, which is going on 5 or 6 years now, from the 5STX to the Digi-troll have a less than 1% failure rate. We run 15lb weights 3-4 days a week on ours, and many days in the Spring/Summer a 20lb weight. We have had 1 DT blow a board in 5 seasons.

Rick,  He has the older hs motors. Just for the record That information about a widespread problem with the motors did not come from me. I have never heard such a thing. Those older hs motors are basically bulletproof and it is very very rare that I ever replace one.

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Just so it's full disclosure, and most people already know this, I have been on Cannon's Prostaff for 5 years.

 

Rick, are you replacing your riggers every year like a lot of captains? I know nothing about the difference in the motors between the Mag 10's and the STX. These were aluminum base Unitrols that I converted to electric with new Mag 10 motors. Repairs were done at Screwie Louies.

 

I don't replace them every year. More like every two years. I know of no captains who replace their riggers every year. That happened a lot back in the day, but it doesn't happen anymore.

 

I don't know how you can bash a company after you took their manual rigger and converted it to electric. Not to mention it was with parts most likely from pre-JO's ownership.

 

Our riggers get about 100 trips (charters, tourneys, and pleasure) a year out of them. That is a lot more than 90% of the guys out there. They've been bullet proof with that 1 exception. If you do have an issue with the new line-up there are many success stories where the customer service department is praised. One of those stories being the pullys.

 

Let's be honest.......You bought a used car, replaced the motor and tranny, and when that went bad you blame the car manufacturer!?!?!?!?

 

Got to love it! I had brand new dual rigger rod holders from cannon at $250 a shot. Plastic end caps fell off due to no glue put on them. Called customer service had to pay for a $4 dollar end cap and shipping on a brand new rod holder. What bull crap I pay for thousands of dollars in riggers and don't get them given to me each year like others, and have to pay for a part a week later!

Now on the other hand I had a four year old rod holder break a weld from Great Lakes Planers (my fault) and Tony sends me a new one now that's customer service.

 

All of the caps are glued on, so that is a false statement. Name one rod holder company that uses caps that hasn't had this problem? Those same companies also sell replacement caps. Apparently, all these guys have an issue when trying to get rubber/plastic to stick to metal.

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Just so it's full disclosure, and most people already know this, I have been on Cannon's Prostaff for 5 years.

I don't replace them every year. More like every two years. I know of no captains who replace their riggers every year. That happened a lot back in the day, but it doesn't happen anymore.

I don't know how you can bash a company after you took their manual rigger and converted it to electric. Not to mention it was with parts most likely from pre-JO's ownership.

Our riggers get about 100 trips (charters, tourneys, and pleasure) a year out of them. That is a lot more than 90% of the guys out there. They've been bullet proof with that 1 exception. If you do have an issue with the new line-up there are many success stories where the customer service department is praised. One of those stories being the pullys.

Let's be honest.......You bought a used car, replaced the motor and tranny, and when that went bad you blame the car manufacturer!?!?!?!?

All of the caps are glued on, so that is a false statement. Name one rod holder company that uses caps that hasn't had this problem? Those same companies also sell replacement caps. Apparently, all these guys have an issue when trying to get rubber/plastic to stick to metal.

Rick I know your in with Cannon and I'm not here to start crap but don't tell my ass I made a false statement! I stated they had no glue on them. I'm not a dumb ass and I know what glue looks like. When I called company they said they are glued on and when I said they had no glue and I had just bought them they charged me. I use cannon riggers but is it good buisness to charge for a lost end cap on a new rod holder its first trip out? You know dam well if u called for a lost end cap they would just mail it out. Sean Brown

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Rick I know your in with Cannon and I'm not here to start crap but don't tell my ass I made a false statement! I stated they had no glue on them. I'm not a dumb ass and I know what glue looks like. When I called company they said they are glued on and when I said they had no glue and I had just bought them they charged me. I use cannon riggers but is it good buisness to charge for a lost end cap on a new rod holder its first trip out? You know dam well if u called for a lost end cap they would just mail it out. Sean Brown

 

I've had lots of caps come off. Most times you can see them starting to come off, and can go without losing it. However, they do glue them on, and every one I've taken off had some type of adhesive in that cap.

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I really didn't want to get into a pissing match about this and to be honest I was undecided about posting it in the first place.  I wanted to leave Screwy Louies out of it as they perform the service and don't make the product.  My beef is with Cannon.  In speaking to Brennan at Screwie Louies he wanted me to explain the problem is not with Cannon motors, but the mother boards on Mag 10 units hauling up 15 lb rigger balls. 

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I bought two new Digi-Troll 10 last season , I had issues with them tripping the circuit breaker and one would just freeze up..... found the boat guys put in too low of breaker changed them out and it was fine. The freezing up was and is still a problem. I have not address this with them yet.

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Looking in from the "outside" of the issues here it appears that some of the frustration is coming from customer service concerns as much as the specific product concerns. It would seem possible that in the manufacturing process a rod holder or two could have been missed in the gluing process and hookedup may have been the unfortunate customer that received it. Quality control no matter who the manufacturer is is far from perfect.  Th crux of the issue is the response from customer service to Sean's concerns...he feels he was treated poorly and we all can certainly relate to that feeling at one time or another these days. Cannon wouldn't still be in business if they had sold "crap" products but in every manufacturing process there are a certain amount of "flawed" units. For most of us the bottom line is what was the company's response to my receiving one of them.  Perhaps issues such as the one Sean brought up should be looked at from that angle in terms of correcting that particular specific instance of a problem to that customers satisfaction....a new part shipped free of charge would have gone a long way and certainly wouldn't break the bank at the company.

Edited by Sk8man

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Looking in from the "outside" of the issues here it appears that some of the frustration is coming from customer service concerns as much as the specific product concerns. It would seem possible that in the manufacturing process a rod holder or two could have been missed in the gluing process and hookedup may have been the unfortunate customer that received it. Quality control no matter who the manufacturer is is far from perfect.  Th crux of the issue is the response from customer service to Sean's concerns...he feels he was treated poorly and we all can certainly relate to that feeling at one time or another these days. Cannon wouldn't still be in business if they had sold "crap" products but in every manufacturing process there are a certain amount of "flawed" units. For most of us the bottom line is what was the company's response to my receiving one of them.  Perhaps issues such as the one Sean brought up should be looked at from that angle in terms of correcting that particular specific instance of a problem to that customers satisfaction....a new part shipped free of charge would have gone a long way and certainly wouldn't break the bank at the company.

I agree Sk8. Plus, the company should have the defective part shipped back to them to see where the problem is in any particular part. Not sure if they do that but they should. I know a lot of co.'s do

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Looking in from the "outside" of the issues here it appears that some of the frustration is coming from customer service concerns as much as the specific product concerns. It would seem possible that in the manufacturing process a rod holder or two could have been missed in the gluing process and hookedup may have been the unfortunate customer that received it. Quality control no matter who the manufacturer is is far from perfect.  Th crux of the issue is the response from customer service to Sean's concerns...he feels he was treated poorly and we all can certainly relate to that feeling at one time or another these days. Cannon wouldn't still be in business if they had sold "crap" products but in every manufacturing process there are a certain amount of "flawed" units. For most of us the bottom line is what was the company's response to my receiving one of them.  Perhaps issues such as the one Sean brought up should be looked at from that angle in terms of correcting that particular specific instance of a problem to that customers satisfaction....a new part shipped free of charge would have gone a long way and certainly wouldn't break the bank at the company.

 

Can't say I disagree with you.

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