Alternative to Copper

[Chicong]

First post here. Looks like a great site. My family has been fishing Canandaigua Lake for about 40 years. We have always used copper rigs for Lake Trout. I have caught and released many many fish. I am 43 years old. I would like to try using lead core line becuase the copper is effective but a paibn in the butt. I don't know what you would use to try the lead core. I have been using Penn 49L reels wiht roller tip rods with the copper. Udually use Pfleuger 4's and 5's wiht the copper. Lately have been using dangling hooks versus the fixed hooks. What should I sue as far as reels and rods and lures for the lead core? Also wondering about othert lures that might work wiht the copper whyile I am also trying the lead. Thanks for the help.

[GAMBLER]

Leadcore will not get you nearly as deep as copper. Try wire dipsies or a thumper rig.

[Yankee Troller]

I would get with FLXTroutman that roams this part of LOU often. He crushes fish on Canadaigua all year long. He uses wire dipseys and copper along with riggers. He a very versatile fisherman and Im willing to bet hed help ya out by showing you first hand come spring.

[chowder]

If you want to target different depths simultaneously core can be a good tool, but if you do not currently use wire dipsy rigs you should probably set up one or two, this will give you an awesome laker spread. Search this forum for advice on wire dipsy setups and I can probably fill in any gaps, if you troll for Lakers you want to be running at least one of these setups!

[fireplug]

Listen to Yankee Troller, FLXTroutman is the man! And, he is always willing to teach, something that can't be said for a lot of successful fishermen (except those on LOU, who have ALWAYS been helpful to me).

[FLXTroutman]

Many thanks to my peeps for the props you are too kind.

Hey chicong, I suspect you are pulling copper like some guys I know

since you are using fixed Pflueger spoons. When we speak of running copper I am using a 9'6" rod with a very very large Penn levelwind reel with dacron backing and 45 lb. copper line with a 30' flourocarbon leader. The reel I have has 600' of copper line, if I let out 300', it gets you down around 66'. (22' of depth per 100' out, is the general consensus). The above mentioned techniques such as wire dipsies, downriggers, and copper line are all deadly especially when run all together.

When you have a program with all the different methods set up you increase your odds since you get more flash, vibration, and attraction to your spread. I run flashers with flies and squids typically and as the guys have stated as well as the owner of the marina where I keep my boat I crush them.

[Chicong]

FLX. Thanks for the info. We have been using like .022 guage copper line for years. No backing and no leader. Just copper. I have always wondered if that was such a good set up. What guage copper do you use? Leader size? We do not use level wind reels. Just open 49L's. that you have to level with your thumb when you are reeling up. We have donated a lot of copper to the bottom. It's just a family thiong we have always done since I was a little kid. Probably not the best way to skin a cat. You have probably snagged a couple of my lines if you fish the east side by the camp. Usually after the fish get out to 70 feet we give up in the middle of the summer. We have never been able to get to the bottom with the reels we have. Probably becuase we have not used any backing. That might help. Our frineds on Senenca Lake have used big pearl flatfish with copper and that seems to work. Personally I have not had much luck withn Suttons. The Pfluegers are heavier and seem to catch more fish. We're probably living in the stone age - any advice would help.

[georged]

Chicong:

I also fish Canandaigua lake alot. I normally use a seth green set up ( multi leader rig ), but I started to pull Copper this year after a friend urged me to try his Copper set up. I had success in a short time and also used this method until the heat of the summer sun kept me from wanting to pull. I used Sutton 88 single hooked spoons that were a heaver gauge than a flutter spoon type. I know weight is important. A friend lent me some Blade Runner spoons which are a copy of the pfluger record lure that you use. I also used some no name spoons that are silver and shaped like a daredevil spoon with a single hook that I purchased at Seneca marine at Watkins Glenn. All worked if put in front of the fish. I spoke with a fellow fisherman who sent me some twin minnow lures, similar to a flatfish with a treble in the rear and a small spinner at the front hook location. He said these were a great copper pulling lure. I will try these this spring. I use a penn 68, 600' of wire and a light action roller tip rod. I use a mono 30 lb test leader about 30" long. I was told by others that a braid leader may work better because it is more durable and does not stretch. I also have purchased a old style wire trolling rig from the 60s ( large manual reel and a short metal rod) I will try this this spring also. You may want to try the seth green rig if you do not have down riggers on your boat. You can fish various depths and multiple lures at the same time. Maybe I'll see you on the water next year I spent at least 50 trips on Canandaigua this past season. Best of Luck.

georged

[FLXTroutman]

http://www.atommiktrollingflies.com/reels.htm

I didn't know the guage of the copper but Atomik is where I bought my set up

see the link guage is .037 45 lb copper

if you check out the link the leader is 50' of 30lb flourocarbon leader.

I connect Spin Doctor with a fly with 22" leader from loop to treble

to snap swivel and run it down the chute.

I bought it prerigged. The backer, copper marked every 100' with black shrink tubing,

the tricky part to me is the connection from copper to flouro leader. They use a tiny Spro swivel

and a haywire twist (no knot) ala The Fish Doctor which is shring tubed also. This tiny swivel will pass the through the guides of the rod and spool right onto the reel. The only other tricky part is letting out the line nice and easy, thumbing the spool

since the spool will pick up momentum in free spool mode as you let line out and you will have the worst birds nest you ever saw if your not careful. I watched Yankee Troller deploy his setup and just follow suit. This rig accounted for catches every time it went out. I believe the Fish Doctor charter Cpt. Ernie Lantiegne captured the $20000 Fall LOC king running copper of planer boards using a 8 Echip Pro Troll flasher and a fly

[chowder]

Troutman, what's your preference for baits on the copper rig? I got the same setup as you from ATOMIC and I got a 300' setup to run off a board, or to save my 10 year old's arms when we don't need to get deeper than 60'.I just got these setups wet once at the end of the season! Do you run flasher/fly combos on these most of the time, or spoons? Also, you said you use squid baits (I am assuming you use these instead of flies, behind a flasher) which ones have worked for you, I have not tried them yet.

[fireplug]

FLX doesn't run spoons with much success

But, he has a great deal of success with flasher/fly combos and other 'secret lures'.

[FLXTroutman]

Hey chowder,

I was running mtn dew spin dr with a Hammer fly on the copper mostly, sometimes a white 8" echip

Proll troll flasher if it was cloudy.

I run glow squids (google John's sporting goods) off 8" and 11" flashers usually 11" on riggers

the 8" on riggers or wire dipsies. I have caught browns and rainbows as well lakers

off the squids on flashers. I like to troll fast to attract the brows and bows running

those baits higher in the water column.