Hey that's cool sk8man...I appreciate the insight. Luckily I know enough about my lake to know where to keep looking...unfortunately this waste of time "work" keeps getting in my way. The perch that we have caught have puked up crayfish...that was just north of rock island on the flats at 25ft. I've heard from guys at the launch that they were catching 30-50 around one of the places I previously mentioned and I've been out there after work, I just keep my distance out of respect because they are always fishing it by the time I get out. I'm sure is a weed line or some structure that's holding them there, but I don't know what they are hitting them on...I'm assuming fatheads off the bottom. Persistence and knowledge will eventually pay off...I'll get on em sooner or later. Thanks bud! Sent from my SM-T550 using Lake Ontario United mobile app