User_155648

Ha,ha no I wasn't referring to you as fat and lazy I don't question one bit your boat and comrade of boat 200 a year your right some do more. I chuckle because some seem to seek a way to squeeze numbers in for illustration purpose if they feel there " numbers" are good. Be it musky, steelhead whatever > numbers guys. your further explanation above confirmed. if you are fortunate to live and fish long enough, you get over catching the most, the largest, certain specific challenge ways like top water only, fly's only, hand made lures,fly's,bamboo,etc only and you come to realize its not about any of that and catching fish is simply a bonus. You fish them your way your terms with a conservation mind. best luck on your high tech, ultra modern quest " top rods" etc. I have Thomas and Thomas two handed spey fly rods that run about a grand each too and years ago I was a st Croix dealer - looked at them as just value rods. Lately pitchin $50 Shimano bait casters - who cares? Latest greatest is marketing hype. Personally I like 70s Fenwick take care lad. Enjoy the journey. Typically after "numbers" comes "trophy hunting" look forward to. Then casting only for rather than draging a half dozen lured behind motor, fast with a bunch of contraptions I between , electronics beeping waiting for the rod to pop, fish hook itself,,,,,,,,angleing go grab some glass (b cast or fly) throw top water casting, rise a musky, hook him on a single hook. Take a quick pic while in the water then share it,,,,,,,that will show me something rather than numbers power trolling a bunch of rods. tell me how you caught 100 casting top water, even blades. "don't care to actually catch fish". Lol , I catch enough lad and live amongst top freshwater fishing by choice my life rather than travel to from the flat lands no need for a "voucher" on your numbers either. I know look at the other lateral line link I left you. 99% of all this lateral line hype started with spinner manufactures, many,many,many moons ago and they keep it churning

Ivan, here you seem to like the In-Fisherman. From the same there is more recent. For "nutts and bolts" just skim down to "Sight,Sound and Research" section of link. http://www.in-fisherman.com/pike-muskie/muskie/sensory-muskies/ Mepps will have to pull out their $$$ pocket book and lobby ………or re-market via flash, sight movement,etc. Funny (to me) was that Mepps just conducted their own little (self serving) sonic studies and recordings > I never trust anything but third party studys when there are $$$ involved. No doubt spinners spank fish but,,,,,,,,,,,,the sonic thing was getting a bit rich via the manufactures of and their $$$ pushing…….over the years/decades. Panther Martin pitched the same sonic/lateral thing for Trout with their spinners for years………………………. Flyfisherman pass on the same BS for generations,decades with Muddler Minnows because of a modest spun deep belly hair head > "puts out vibes , lateral lines pick up on " BS has been around so long now in regards to the Muddler Minnow, generations have actually grown up hearing it as kids……….Thinking it's true. LOL Like humans but internal ear, many fish can hear better than feel vibes. Humans feel vibes too but see and hear better. Spinner manufactures want to make you believe that the sport fish we seek most as a group are like a flying bats …….radar (lol) ,,,,,,but their selling and we are buying . Dark water, night,etc. a lot of fish, mammals, etc. which hunt,eat others,predators can see much better in darkness than humans……..nothing new there…….it doesn't make them…… bat like…….which spinner manufactures and their "thumper blades" etc. would like you to believe. So it all goes back to what you pointed out "blind eye" and large plugs with gangs of hooks don't help a Muskys much needed vision perhaps even greater odds of once in the net. Unless you see the hook stick in and/or take out the eye > your not going to notice it at all if it's severely scratched,damaged the eye predominately at release. BTW- I pull plugs also, don't like it, rather turn my head but it's real. Like the modest Pike-O in my avatar I remove what hooks I can (center in this case) and limit the size/length of the plug as a whole. Net and plugs be it eye's to scars are another issue but, they are getting better.

Ivan, Your right you "don't know me" and yet, twice now you have made Assumption's typical to internet forums and decided to point out and print your Assumptions in reply. Your Assumption's are wrong. * "fit in with" - I have nothing against motor trolling at all. I have owned a half dozen motor boats strictly for fishing over the decades from small "pikie/walleye boats" with an outboard to 21' Searay buddy set up for Lake Erie, along with 5 kayaks (2 sit in - 3 sit on top) all rigged for fishing……before Kayak fishing was cool. Why? because I have always fished and lived near/next to water. My personal issue with motor boats is not trolling, in fact the exact opposite it's boats are bigger and faster than ever on small - modest lakes. I would like to see some limets in Speed and/or HP allowed on certain modest waters like Chautauqua. * There is no need to get defensive. I am sure your release methods are sound. You alone brought up the blind eye in the photo which sparked panfisher's observation's of a recent large Chaut. musky. * Read my bio before you start assuming. I have an interest in old,retro ways and collect to a small extent. I also hunt/shoot Woodchucks with an old pre-war Winchester Model 70, Super Grade, 22 Hornet with a old Redfield Widefield 4x fixed scope. * I have had interest in and partaken in paddling/rowing for years. Some of my friends also have drift boats for rivers. Rowing "Chautauqua Double Enders" to fish, is as old and historic as dirt. If you frequent here you should know this tradition. Ditto with the St.Lawrance River Skiff on Ontario and the S.L.R. Row / paddle trolling and fishing/casting from in general is effective, takes skill, much less boreing than power trolling > more like casting, is rewarding and one Hell of a Workout while you fish ! I also hit the gym off season,gym member year round, bicycle, etc. American's have become fat,lazy asses, which seek the easiest softest way ……..I am not one nor wish to contribute ! * There is fine workmanship craftsmanship in such. I appreciate that as a union tin knocker in the building trades for twenty years prior and the son of a union brick layer. I was raised around old school craftsmanship * On the other hand I would have Zero Issue with single hook Musky regulations as on certain Wisconsin, Ontario waters being implemented on Chautauqua if a Study showed it helped natural reproduction in Any way,shape or form. I could live with that but, I am not in it for $$$, professionally, in any way either as some are whom need to put fish in the boat and I am not sure a study would confirm this or not? I assume the area's that have done this could shed some light in regards to. Your out dated links on feeding > Look up an actual recent study by highly educated on rather than internet forum chat,etc. > Dr. John New / Loyola University . It has been publicly available for some time. The only ones whom don't want to hear the truth are Mepps and similar for obvious $$$ reasons ! Not to worry the flash from spinners is more than enough Sight and I am sure they will change they're marketing tune to that, in the name of the almighty buck, soon enough just as net companies managed to strictly the netting/capture of and keep to with a net (definition - "to catch or ensnare" ) to "pens", " C & R ", CPR tools " for $$$ but at least they are trying and overall gotten a little better. * I caught and released a approx 45" recently that was all beat and scared in the mouth,jaw,face from, like pan fisher seen. So his reply,concern………….I could relate to………as it is a pretty ugly scenario……….yet………I doesn't warrant in reply > "if your afraid to hurt fish then don't fish"……….and again you brought up the blind eye in photo before all. * Stereotype - "the Northern Wisconsin guys, where trolling is illegal". LOL > yea, all the lakes in Northern Wisconsin are illegal to troll and them guys are like that. There are not certain ones that limit, it's all of them. Nor were there certain reason's for such > it's that Northern Wisconsin guys mentality. …………………….. wew ! You replied in debating, argumentative way to me on another conservation thread I started even though I asked at the start for all to refrain from such and just speak their peace,opinion as we all have a right to. I ignored. Now a short time later your making in-correct Assumption's and rather than keeping it to yourself you decide you want to point out in reply = set the record straight. The reality is any and all this musky conservation talk be it release techniques, scares,etc. if Good, creates awareness, improvements, better angling, etc. and that is an absolute proven fact of time…………..so I am glad you pointed out the blinded eye and pan fisher noted heavy scars on another. Take care Ivan > "out of a couple hundred plus Muskies, year" Touch'e

Panfisher I will add - most recent scientific studys also show " fish experience little to no pain ". the visual external hook scars, though no doubt an ugly sign of man which certainly can and should be minimized, to the less visual internal jaw scars - don't inflict pain as we know it and are typically not affecting survival rate (exception - loss of eye sight) , natural reproduction, etc. over playing the fish especially in warm temps, removal from water, disease from fin damage via net,protective slime coat,etc,etc all have substantially more potential mortality than external and internal hook scars are the mouth of a musky (exception eyes) though ugly and could-should be reduced. of similar note - bass are quite hardy. Techniques used along with the physical structure of bass themselves - don't lend to scaring. Yet, similar could be noted about the handling of bass for catch and release easily and by "pros" themselves. I know I have raised an eyebrow more than once watching the "pros" in regards to. Their luck bass are so hardy and adaptable . Unlike Trout,Musky,etc please excuse - poke from my smartphone while multi tasking

most recent studies show lateral have very little to know effect on musky feeding. L lines are used only in the last few inches of a strike with sight. They are sight feeders. Blind muskys die. Plugs with gangs of hooks cause scaring, blindness, caught multiple times and released over years. From the strike, fight to the net entanglement of, followed by thrashing , first scoop of net. Ditto scaring around mouth from plus hooks cut. its the ugly truth of musky conservation, catch and release and this is before issued removing from water for hero shot pictures of modest fish, measurements ,etc that could have been shaped while I'm water. bar less single hook baits (jigs,spoons,spinnerbaits, fly's) are the best. Large plugs with gangs of trebles the worst. this is nothing new. The concern from experience written back to when large plugs with "gangs of hooks " were first introduced first simply decoys with trebles added this is why many musky waters are single hook only catch and release. speed trolling big plugs with trebles, drags set tight, then netting (with any net include pen) where hooks get caught at entry is amongst the worst for of concern for as I do row troll plugs cranks lately I have been pulling single hook spinner bait (with no single stinger) as an angler yourself your observations in regards to are " spot on " sometimes the obvious is easier for the non specific to see and the specific users don't want to see the obvious. hopefully over time on behalf of musky conservation we will find ways to improve this while still being able to catch and release enough musky to fill the soul good catch - observation poked from my smart phone , no edit

Nice stuff by all Its good to read the little pet peavies we all have too. It helps put things in perspective including some of the explanations which made sense after I read them. Regardless how it's achieved > primarily I am a for natural reproduction , particularly in native waters. Locally, I question at times whether certain NYS employee's and the local historic hatchery feel the same any more or if they are more concerned with keeping their job's. It seems no one really has a even fairly accurate, factual number for the percentage of Chautauqua Musky in Chautauqua Lake that are natural/wild versus tank raised > Thats troubleing and makes me raise an eyebrow of question in regards to.

While power trolling multiple lines at a good clip has been hot for some, how about the casting bite? Is casting action picking up ? Recently, I heard it was, after a slow start. Personally, I have cast a fare amount with out any landed via casting, so far. I have landed a couple row trolling a double ender, including a very nice, heavy one………which was very up close, personal,fun in such a boat. Thanks

Nice fish and photograph

* Chautauqua Lake * I would appreciate it if bioligist studies on the natural reproduction of Musky were a) regularly scheduled b) more public access to, more public awareness made and findings posted vividly on the NYS DEC website along with NYS Chautauqua region vacation,things to do literature. * I would like to see a public awareness made regionally similar to Bald Eagle,Osprey,Great Blue Heron,Great Horned Owl's, etc. BTW- The same could be said for Brook Trout and Lake Trout of the region. * Shore line natural reproduction habitat ~ has taking a beating on Chautauqua. NYS owns a fare amount now and is looking to buy more (my understanding). Yet, I don't see a substantial effort by the state to improve the natural shore line, over time, for natural Musky reproduction,spawning, on what they own now. I would like to see that. * Size keep limet = change to zero, put them all back imo. * Litter, pollution, cigarette butts,cans,,etc. - more public awareness to even fines, it has to subside. I re-started smoking a couple years ago but, carry a butt can. It takes approx. 8-10 years for a filtered cig butt to bio degrade. Cans,trash,etc. it Really fry's me! I pick up trash and put in cans at some of the state,town owned public area's. In particular Cheneys Pt is a pet peeve project of mine I took under my wing and correspond/work with the Town of North Harmony in regards to. MORE PUBLIC AWARENESS AND OR FINES ARE NEEDED. Added around the lake in recent years are some excellant "entering Chautauqua Lake Watershed" conservation awareness signs. More in regards to littler is needed. * Gas,petro,oil, speed,size and quanity of power boats to jt ski's - I don't know what can be done but, compared to 40 years ago in the mid 70's it is "night and day" worst. The recreational boats are Much bigger and Much faster than ever, jet ski's, etc. The majority seems Much faster. At times even the noise level from is annoying when your trying to enjoy the outdoors. I can't imagine how much petro,oil is ending up in the lake from all this? The lake gets all stored up. I am not a biologist but, it can't be good for the Musky native reproduction nor stocked ! I wish there was a motor size / speed limits enforced………….something ! In the 70s……the cabin cruisers………"cruised"……fishing boats were not freakin speed boats…………water ski boats were modest…….not huge, fast ,,,,,,,,,the louder the better and with boom boxes blair, there were no jet skis ! A lot has changed - negatively. Regulations are needed to down size the problem. Besides the Musky and anglers in general……..I feel for the sailing crowd……I never got into it but always respected it……..speaking with some lately they can hardly get out on Chaut. and other lakes these days because of and often have to go in groups / pods…….strength in numbers……….sad. * Video/Camera or other release - Most Musky that are lifted from the water prior to release are lifted for a photo and/or measurement, from a hold pen net or hand. It would be nice if technology brings down the costs of Go/Pro's, video and/or low cost,water proof camera's speeds became quicker and anglers excepted ~ simply video or photograph the musky in the pen net, hand,etc. in the water rather than lifting ~ as good enough - slip'ed the net hoop back over for release and hardly if at all touched the fish,left it in the water - were o.k. with just estimate the size,length and weight rather than needing to put on a board. Ten years latter you would probably enjoy much more a one minute video clip from a Go Pro, friends hand held of the battle and water release than you would remember what it was like putting the 50 inches on the board for accurate measurement of 51 1/2" rather than approx 50" Musky Tourneys are for conservation……….there are other ways to award than board,exact measurements…….which leave the fish in the water where it belongs. * Hooks - Do we really need three sets of treb hooks on some plugs? Isn't two more than enough? Frankly, I appreciate the jig,spinner bait,fly guys using one for C & R. * State Volunteer Involvement - NYS has to lighten up, have some release forms at hand or something. Plenty of people want to help volenteer with Musky stocking etc. but, it's gotten to where………via state worries (law suits via injury etc.) ………they basically steer volunteers away…………..yet……….the state complains about not having enough fishery funds! Get some release forms printed and ready ~ not liable, there are plenty willing to help, volenteer NYS …….get your act together ! What did John F, Kennedy say huh ? ! "Its's not what your country can do for you but, what you can do for your country " !!!!! well……….damn it……..let us help ! it's as if your steering community service, envolvment away, now a days not just with fisheries but your parks and other…………….think about it !

*Musky Conservation In General ~ Improved Natural Reproduction ~ Public Awareness ~ Etc. * If you could do anything to everything, including every little "pet peeve" you personally have that you think, in the big picture, negatively effects Musky Conservation - Natural Reproduction, list them here. * Note - PLEASE THIS IS NOT A DEBATE ! Please do not attempt to argue with another persons opinion. Example : someone may state "get rid of all jet ski's" and give reason's why and another has three jet skis besides their Musky boat and is inclined to argue…………… Its's not about that………………PLEASE do not reply to anyone in argumentative or debate fashion. This is just about gathering data,thoughts. If one wants to list "why" after………….let them………with out argument………who cares……….it's all for attempt in good and everyone has a right to their opinion. If you want to list certain waters of your concern = go ahead if not = don't. * Simple easy, full freedom, no arguing , debate's etc.