S Mick

Brutes all the way. Just be sure to order them with the variable speed control/ auto stop. You will not be dissapointed.

Diversion hit the nail on the head...... My Merc manual lists 5psi at a "HOT IDLE" as the extreme low side of operation for the 3.7. That being said my 94' 5.7 Merc has 40 psi at cold startup,( it also lists 5psi as the bottom number psi) and I have seen it go as low as 12-15psi at a hot idle after a 6 mile running at times 3800-4000 rpm (nearly W.O.T.). After running a good ways at 3200-3500 (normal operation), I will see anywhere between 20-30psi after coming off plane and down to an idle to troll, but I gain 8-10 psi back after 10-15 minutes of trolling (as oil cools). I am running 20W/40, and I wouldn't go any lower than that in weight. Remember, boat motors are under servere strain at all times, and should not be compared with automotive engines although they they share many of the same internal componenets. If you would place your vehicle at the bottom of a steep incline, and chain another vehicle behind it and run it at near full throttle for miles, this is close to what a marine engine operates at each time it is on plane. Also, be sure to check for any obstructions in regards to the inline oil cooler/heat exchanger. If you are not cooling your oil properly under normal operation you will see very quick breakdown of your oil regardless of make/weight. As with any mechanical item, rememeber, excessive heat is an enemy. In short, I would change over to a good 20W/40, and check your oil cooler for any sort of blockage, any take her for a run. Good idea to mark your guage at both cold startup and hot idle to make it easy to read. (I have all my guages marked for range of operation) Going forward, running an oil temp guage will also be a big benefit, especially in early detection of a problem as you're running, as once the pressure ABNORMALLY drops, the damage is usually done.

When setting bags out, I now place the boat in neutral and place the bags into the water letting them sink, fill/open completely. Once both lines are secured at a length that keeps the bags even with the transom, and about a foot below the waterline, i place the boat in gear. If I attempt to set the bags with the boat moving they never seem to completely fill/run correctly, I believe the turbulence alongside the hull adversely affects the water trying to enter into the bag by causing a low pressure area along the hull, which pulls the bag toward/under the boat. Hope this helps ya.

Yes I am hesitant to change the prop for that very reason. What size boat do you have for the 2 28" bags? I was thinking I need 2 22" bags for my 22 footer. 24' Thompson, 230 HP 305 Merc Alpha 1. I usually only have 1 bag out when trolling, mostly so I can kick the rpms up a bit and get better speed control, but in really snotty lake conditons I'll put em both out to smooth out the ride. Tim Another vote for bags. Same engine, same boat here. One thing Tim did not mention is the added benefit (especially on an older boat) is the ability to run a little higher RPM with both bags out, which maintains a bit more oil pressure, and helps to keep the plugs from fouling. I personally have never had an issue with fouled plugs, but have spoken to a couple guys guys who, after half a summer are changing plugs due to constant ultra low RPM. Also, while trolling in a quartering sea, bags will help to stabilize the boat. As far as a kicker goes, I was considering an install this past winter, but decided against i due to the large initial cash outlay, and speaking from a safety standpoint, if you are concerned about being able to reach port if the motor dies, it's much cheaper and (I hope) probably just as effective to spend the 80.00 for the TowBoatUS service. Emergency trailer service is also included. Sorry for rambling.

Thanks for the feedback RR. I kinda figured that I needed to get my speed down, and switch over to 50Khz. Was my first spring Bar experience, so I was really spending alot of time trying to lay waypoints on certain contours that were holding fish, but I should have been watching the effects of the current speed, as it ceratinly was playing havoc with the riggers last Saturday. I was just concerned that I may have damaged the Ducer when I left it on while outta the water. I did contact Airmar and was told that leaving the unit on for an extended period of time (4-8hrs) while out of the water can damage the ceramic pickup element in the transducer. Doing so can actually can cause small cracks by way of high powered sonar pinging the heck out of ducer and actually overheating it. They assured that infrequent situations such as what I described should cause no harm to the unit. Thanks again.

Only real way is to pull the lower unit and taking a flashlight, peer through gimbal and check the coupler splines. If splines look razor sharp, and/or broken it's shot. Also, check the input shaft splines for an type of burrs/sharp edges, as these are good indicators the coupler has seen it's days. If coupler is shot, and in need of replacement, motor must be pulled. Once new coupler is installed, be sure engine/ drive alignment is dead on. Merc makes a special alignment tool that is specifically designed to ride on the gimbal bearing and depending on the "slip fit" indicates if the adjustable engine mounts on your Star or Port side need raised or dropped to provide correct allignment. Not doing so is one sure way to tear up your gimbal bearing and your new coupler. Best bet is to follow fellow board members advice and have an authorized dealer or marine mechanic deal with it.

Last weekend running the bar in 80FOW, I was easily tracking riggers with both 200khz/50khz cones. Once we ran into 130+ FOW, I was losing the 200Khz picture as far as riggers go (very,very faint lines). I am thinking that my downspeed+ area current and increased FOW was affecting the narrow cone 200Khz from effectively tracking the riggers. Although my downspeed was prolly a bit high (x-4 Hawk on backorder) with the current in the area, I was concerned that I was experiencing a x-ducer issue. This trip was the shakedown with my brand new electronics array. Running a Airmar B60 thru-hull w/ Raymarine DSM300 1K sounder/ c120W display. Sounder was left in "auto" mode, but I did attempt to play around with the gain and zoom in 200Khz manual but really made no difference other than normal results, IE screen clutter/feedback. Was running 10# balls and Ducer is flush mounted directly beneath engine crank pulley and to STBD side at nearest point to keel. Just wondering what others running dual freq. x-ducers are used to seeing and at what depth in regards to riggers. Also, has anyone accidentally left their sounder powered up for an hour or so while boat is on trailer, and if so, have you experienced any adverse affects to your sounder/x-ducer by doing so? Like usual, was in a hurry Saturday afternoon to get outta the mid-day T-storm/downpour and ended up leaving the the unit powered up as we loaded at Wilson/ made the tow back to Olcott/ cleaned fish. Prolly was on for a little over an hour by the time I realized it.

Magic Erasers are the best thing I've found to remove just about anything that can get on a boat. I scrubbed down my swim platform and the cooler mounted on it last fall, both were covered in that nasty black residue from tree sap/pollen... Came right off. Took scuffs right off the deck as well.

Looks good! Do you think running the bags futher towards the transom may help you keep course? I was told 6" from the transom, and to keep em' as close as possible. I would think attaching them at a point closer to the rear (Midship) would make them less prone to pull the bow around inturn making the AP work double time?? I dunno just a thought. Anyways, Sorry to Hijack the thread H-Office, my apologies. Mick

I assume you have added cleats at midship to tie off to w/bags? Basically same setup here, and use them for the same reasons, except I need to get down to 1.2-1.5 when turnin' colorado blades for eyes. Interesting w/ the 1 bag deployment, are you placing on the leeward side when trolling at angle into seas? Also, how tight do your Outfitter bags run in relation to the hull? -Mick

Makes sense Tim. In my situation the cable and running gear was screwed up so the Hydro unit was opted for. Little more cash, but if the cable replacement wasn't an issue, the Simrad would have been going on. In the long run though, if a kicker install is being considered at some point, I would prolly rather have full hydro, as it requires less moving parts... Just less to break/easier to fix if it does I guess. BTW, are you trolling down w/ bags or a plate, or utilizing both? Just wondering if you notice any difference in the way the AP and the boat act when bags are out if you use them. I know when fishing Erie this boat really settles down w/bags and the AP doesn't work nearly as much. I am thinkin this will be my deciding factor when debating the kicker install or not. I may be just complicating things and shooting myself in the foot if I choose to install one. Even though fishing Ontario does not require bags to be deployed for speed control purposes, I'm thinkin' I'll prolly put em out to settle the boat and hold course with less effort in regard to the AP. Any thoughts? Mick

Tim, just curious, why not just change over to full hydraulic? I'm running a 240 Hardtop like yourself and it originally had a KING AP on it, when that gave up, a non-gyro Ray unit was installed along with full hydro to the helm. Head unit is a ST6002. I was contemplating a kicker install this winter and spoke with a few captains running the same full hydro unit along with EZ steer to a kicker and all had nothing but good to say about it. I've never done a price comparison between the Ray unit w/hydro steering vs. a Simrad unit, but the total for my Ray/Hydro install was close to 2100. To each his own I guess. One thing I will say is that once you have the full Hydro to the helm, you'll never want to own a boat without it. Handling and steering response is greatly improved as well. Unit is very quiet also.

Just recieved word that everything shipped yesterday. So much for the 2 week backorder!! Should be at the house in two days. I guess it's time to drag her outta storage and get busy.

Join the club, complete electronics array on 2 week back-order from Anchor Express. Radar/ Multifunction Display/ Sounder Module/ Thru-Hull x-ducer. Really put a damper on my Friday to say the least. Oh well, good thing it's just March.

I dunno about out in the lake, but pre-spawn migratory fish slammed the spoons that were barely glowing. Fished Olcott piers pretty much every Friday in late Sept and a few days in October at night and did very well throwing casting spoons that were "glow". Never took a hit on spoons that were just flashed/charged. My bud started using an LED flashlight to charge his spoons, and seemed to have better/more consistant results. I wouldn't base any conclusions on this in regards to the lake though, different beast altogether in the fall.

Not to throw fuel onto the fire, but in my eyes what's the difference? All three will prolly work just fine, and depending on your personal likes/dislikes in regards to x-ducer mounting, display methods, etc, all three will fill the bill. My biggest concern would be whether or not the performance of the unit remained consistant in regards to speed/temp on a day to day basis.

Good advice, and if you really want to help her out, have a decent amount of room above the distributor, and can find the resources, set #1 cylinder to TDC (fire) mark distributor base with a scribe or ink marker and then remove it. Either renting (from mechanic) or making (using old distributor drive shaft) you can utilize a 3/8ths drill to spin up the oil pump, effectively creating enough oil pressure to lubricate the entire engine. This way, when you fire the engine, you will have lubricated the mains, cam bearings, rocker assembly, and hydraulic lifters if so equipped, and minimize the chances of taking out a bearing or damaging a lifter at startup. May seem a little over the top, but after sitting for a few years, your engine will thank you for it. Oh yeah, change the oil before doing so. or you could crank it over with out the plugs in it , that way there will be no load on the main bearings and everthing will get oiled ! Moto, not sure if that method will spin oil pump fast enough to get pressure to the top end. It is a P.I.T.A. but on any application that sits for extrended periods of time (yrs.) I have practiced this method and it was only way to get oil psi on a guage without actually starting the engine. Just a suggestion.

Good advice, and if you really want to help her out, have a decent amount of room above the distributor, and can find the resources, set #1 cylinder to TDC (fire) mark distributor base with a scribe or ink marker and then remove it. Either renting (from mechanic) or making (using old distributor drive shaft) you can utilize a 3/8ths drill to spin up the oil pump, effectively creating enough oil pressure to lubricate the entire engine. This way, when you fire the engine, you will have lubricated the mains, cam bearings, rocker assembly, and hydraulic lifters if so equipped, and minimize the chances of taking out a bearing or damaging a lifter at startup. May seem a little over the top, but after sitting for a few years, your engine will thank you for it. Oh yeah, change the oil before doing so.

Great site you guys have here, first time post and wouldn't you know it has to do with an AP question. Anyway, I've spent a better part of the winter re-rigging and was contemplating a kicker install on my boat, however I love the AP and am not sure how well it will operate if connected to the I/O via EZ steer or something comparable. I currently run the ST6001 non gyro unit along with full hydraulic to the helm (24 ft Thompson HT) my question is in regard to whether or not this unit can, without issue effectively operate if an EZ steer to a kicker is utilized. Being that the unit is fully hydraulic, it in effect has no cable to move other than the steering arm to the I/O unit, I can't see why it wouldn't work? The unit performs flawlesslty at low speeds (under 3.0) and holds a course perfectly, although some messing with the sensitivity is needed if trolling in rough water (4'+). Thanks in advance. Looking forward to getting out on the water this spring.