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King Davy

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  1. For a few years I ran a big corporate charter group out of the Westinghouse factory In Pittsburgh. We had 100 guys come in on two trailway busses. I had 25 Charter Captains work that gig and we even held a big fish tournament. Joe was always one of the boats that participated and was always eager to help with the details. After awhile Joe took that group over and they continued to come up and enjoy LO. RIP Capt. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United
  2. My biggest on the lake many years ago was 16 pounds caught right in front of the Oak during the Spring ESLO. My biggest in a river was also in that 15/16 pound range on the Salmon River three years ago on May 1. Land locks are only stocked in two places these days. The Salmon River, and Oak Orchard. Creel Census data from this years trib study points to over 2k caught from fall of 2019 to today on the Oak alone. Now what that means that a good number of Salmon were in the Oak and caught several times. Last month I caught three in one outing, with two of them post spawn and over 25 inches. And I would agree they are a whole different sporting experience caught on a rod and reel in a river VS being pulled in from a moving boat. Water temp last month on the day I caught those fish was 34 degrees and they were five feet in the air several times. Caught one a couple years ago in the Genny that jumped 14 times. And why they are considered the greatest river sport fish anyway around the world. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United
  3. Gamblers right. With this years stocking numbers they are trying to maximize survival and if their studies are correct which I’ve always believed that we are catching salmon stocked from many different sites, this could minimize a down turn in catch success. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United
  4. Yeah I get the disappointment. When on the lake I fish out of Sandy Creek more than any other. Sandy is probably the busiest port of all smaller sites when you add up both the lake and trib effort for salmon and trout. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United
  5. So the stakeholder panel met with DEC on 2/12. Anyone else in the room keep me honest if I miss something. Only stocking the 835k fish this year. DEC put up several charts on years of study results taken from creel study’s wire tag results etc that showed no matter where salmon were stocked they wandered the entire lake and salmon didn’t hang near their ports of stocking either pen or direct stocked. Wire tags tell where fish are stocked. And caught. And they had catch rate records (pie charts) with a break down of fish caught from extreme west to extreme East in the open waters of Lake Ontario. Example: The charts showed that fish stocked in the west were caught from one end of the lake to the other. Next they produced more studies from Dr Mike Connerton on salmon straying from pen or direct stocked locations and the results are straying was minimal. Jana Lantry from region 6 and other biologists at DEC have done studies that there was greater survival of stocked fish when they were stocked in larger mass numbers wise VS split up into smaller pods. Results of these strategies and studies brought three options to the table to the stakeholder panel. Two of the options were similar. Which cuts out the smaller ports and moves all of stocking to the ports listed above. All in net pens to achieve the best survival and returns to that port to spawn. We the stakeholders were asked to vote on the options. The majority voted for option one that put the ports mentioned in play. Can only speak for myself but I was in the majority on the vote. My reason was in this significant stocking cut, survival of the reduced number to adult stage was paramount. I do believe the data that states salmon are caught all over the lake and the stocking site didn’t impact the overall open water success and if studies are correct that larger groups of fish survive better rather than broken up in smaller groups we might see much improved staging fishing off the larger ports that will be this years stocking sites. Disappointing for the sites cut out, but in the interim if this stocking strategy maintains the over all fishing success it will be worth it. DEC is trying to architect the best solution for success during this cut down in stocking situation. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United
  6. Yeah Bob nobody wishes this prey situation would right itself anymore than I and I’m sure everyone feels that way. It’s not just that good salmon fishing takes pressure off steelhead, it’s the solid runs of kings into rivers that attract steelhead from the lake months before they are actually ready to spawn. To include non spawning scout rainbows that are attracted to the dinner table of eggs and flesh. I’ve spent a lot of time in the last 20 years all over Alaska. There’s a reason that king salmon and sockeye are the sacred saviors of those fisheries. They feed the trout and re-fertilize the habitat. I know you guys will catch steelhead off shore. You guys have every right to. Bob I believe this reg is trying to balance the heat they’re going to take if the salmon fishing gets difficult. You and I lived through this last time. And you and I and many others had to fish for all species cause the salmon numbers were down. And reading the reg rational that’s what it looks like. The guys I fish with and or are acquaintances have no ill feelings towards guys fishing the lake and how they fish or what they fish for. But we still want a shot at these marvelous game fish throughout the fall, winter and spring. I truly believe that DEC is trying to keep both environments viable especially through this difficult bait fish situation. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United
  7. Yup I’ve met him. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United
  8. Not saying question shouldn’t be welcome. Saying the nasty behaviors yelling and all that has gone on at some of these meetings is highly unprofessional and not very civilized. And if you’ve been to enough of them then you’ve seen it. We have to respect each other. Then and only then do we have a true partnership. DEC is a group of appointed positions, yes by elected officials but do we not think a measure of due diligence is enacted to make those appointments? Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United
  9. One other thing. DEC is under no obligation to hold all these public meetings, to show up to be scrutinized by those who don’t like their news. They do it because they care what we think. I know they listen and consider our feed back. BUT... they have a lot of data, 51 years of past history that has tendencies with results that match up with past, existing, and probable future results to govern their management decisions. They will be the first ones to tell you not every decision they’ve made was dead on perfect, but they’ve had a lot more wins than loses. They are up against the ultimate player. Who always gets the best hand ....Mother Nature. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United
  10. Rick, I guess you should ask DEC these questions. However They can’t participate in coming on this site. So ask to speak to them. I’ve put what my “assumptions” are on why the current proposal. But I’m guessing. I’m guessing at what would make sense to me on why, which included the history of the 90’s early 2000 when the steelhead fishery in the tribs ultimately went south because of the increased harvest on the lake due to diminished salmon fishing success. Serious shortfalls of steelhead to the hatchery back in those days. The crash of the adult steelhead fishery in 2014, and 15 from the poisonous alewives. We still haven’t fully recovered to the fishing we had before the die off. Finally everyone who attended any state of the lake meetings saw the statement DEC led the presentation with. They recognize the two marquee species targeted by all stakeholders both lake and tribs are king salmon in the lake and steelhead in our rivers. Which makes up the majority of the interest in our 12 month a year sport fishery. From the very beginning of this program in the late 60’s has this been the basis of management strategy. Again my take... right, wrong, or indifferent is that in the face of another probable down turn in salmon fishing success after three years of cuts, (and we all await what’s next) still trying to get the steelhead fishery fully on its feet, they are trying to manage for opportunity in that year long sport fishery. It’s clear there are many that don’t agree with this direction. But I know we can’t get this back to where everyone is happy until we get through this predator prey issue and have full salmon stocking again. That takes pressure off trout species, allowing pretty stellar fishing all year long. I am 100% in agreement that the fishery only becomes fabulous again if we have a full fledged king salmon program. Everything else falls into place when that’s good. Last thing, our fishery managers, scientists, biologists, technicians, and staff have kept this fishery viable for 51 years through all these obstacles. At what point are you naysayers going to trust the professionals they are? Every other Great Lakes fishery has crashed hard, except this one. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United
  11. Just a couple of corrections here. The 25” size limit is up for comment that is a tributary reg only. Does not include the open waters of Lake Ontario. Lake stays at 21”. Clarification- Bob’s statement in the copy of one of his posts above that “they” are now coming for our lake creel on steelhead. The “they” is not the tributaries stakeholders. He knows as well as everyone else in that room we never asked for a creel reduction in the lake. We did seek the 25” limit for lake and tribs and it was not accepted. DEC took all the discussion from the panel, held several internal meetings with regional managers and staff, also looked at past history of what other domino’s fell during the last round of King salmon cuts from the 90’s to early 2000’s. The steelhead fishery on the rivers was bleak at best returns to the hatchery impacted and they came back with this regulation. That’s how we got to this point. Anybody who thinks trib stakeholders went in demanding creel cuts on the lake is simply misinformed. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United
  12. There are dozens of web boards up and down the lake from tackle shops to lodging, etc that have daily fishing reports on all these rivers not to mention Instagram, FB etc. DEC is doing stream creel surveys this year from 18 mile to the Black River. Talked to the young lady last week who was touring the western tribs. She’s done 800 interviews on Sandy alone since first of Sept. There are articles in river fishing magazines that name many rivers in this area. The salmon river , save the Kenai in Alaska is the busiest river in the US. I used to get annoyed when these waterways were mentioned but in reality it’s public news every single day. There is no stopping it. I spend a lot of my fall time fishing the sound for bass and tuna or the FL because I can’t get close to the LO smaller or medium size rivers and spend most of my time fishing them once the weather gets nasty. And this year winter started first of November. Crowded rivers are a lot harder to fish then a busy day on the lake. But it’s a lost cause to sit around waiting for people to go away. Just go, set your expectations realistically and fish. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United
  13. Except for some brook trout ponds deep in the Adirondacks. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United
  14. Yeah the horse has been out of the barn for many many years on any secret spots in any of our LO tribs. I can walk away from crowds on some waterways and do, but since social media those days are over. However you can share fish locations in the lake to include Lat Lon numbers and you can still find room to fish because they are always swimming. If you want to fish any river in the Great Lakes including Canada you are never going to be lonely. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United
  15. The state TU meeting was also attended by DEC. We are involved in several river and stream rehab projects with them across the state. Get a hold of the bureau chief of fisheries and ask him how I handled my presentation. Completely on the up and up sticking to the facts. The general council made a motion to have TU officially support these regs. I rescinded the motion explaining that DEC was simply looking for individual stake holders to comment with their personal experiences and why they either supported or not any of the regs. Not just the lake Steelhead reg. Feel free to friend me on FB and you’ll read the comments from attendees that after my talk appreciated why this isn’t a TU state or National initiative. This was about trib anglers and there are many that are TU members that fish the LO tribs. From all over NYS. This was simply an awareness presentation and truthfully many we’re already aware and had previously commented. Everyone who enjoys this fishery has a right to have knowledge of current events and can get involved if they choose to. Especially those that don’t live along the lake shore and can get to a meeting from the Catskills, Adirondacks, LI, NYC etc. It was that simple.
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