HB2

Well , the DEC has said repeatedly that it is bait related. I have my armchair quarterback theory on why but they are the guys with the most experience with this . Banner year this year they supplied . I saw the most bait I have seen in a long time out there this year . There has been a biatfish biomass rebound the last few years . We are only about 5# off the mark for bigger fish actually. Let's see what happens when we have continuous years with good bait instead of using this as an excuse to close the tribs . Let's wait and see next year if avg and top end are bigger . We had a banner year . Be happy for that and hope for the best . I met the daughter in San Antonio of a guy who fishes a lot of Lakers in lake Superior. I have been going back and forth with him. The Lakers he catches average 5 # and a 10# is a big fish . If he gets a 10 fish day , that's a lot . He is jealous of what we have . It certainly could be worse . We are not Lake Superior.

Relax , the sky is not falling . At least not yet .

The distain for the trib guys on this site really urks me . An awfull lot of crying for nothing . Are 30 fish days with 15 to 25 # kings not enough ? These fish are there for everyone to catch . Everyone gets their chance at them at some time during the year . Those Salmon River guys don't hurt the fishery one bit . In fact , even with the outlaws , they probably help . It's put and take . If a guy has a successful trip and comes back next year , all the better . Each out of state angler probably drops 150$+ per day minimum up here. The Pulaski region relies on that which is pretty much all they have . I personally love fishing for these tributary kings .It's really a challenge to get them to hit . And they might not have the power they had in the lake but they sure do fight .Had many, many , run 150 yds up or down the creek I could not stop . And so do a lot of other guys because I talk to them.Some come up every year . Some don't want , or can't afford 700 to 1 k a day to pay a charter and have a mate hand then a rod and reel the fish in . I was invited in a charter this year . Awesome captain and mate . If that's what salmon fishing is , I'll take up birdwatching . The only chart or data that really matters to the state of NY is the one about economic impact . Which is probably why the judges in those municipalities the tickets get written in throw the cases out . And I don't care if a fish hits because it's hungry , out of aggression , it's a conditioned response or it just made a bad decision . It hit by its own choice .He took my bait ,which to me is what it's all about. Getting them to hit . Are we going to make fishing WOKE now ?

So now it's ," well they hit , but why did they hit? Were they actually feeding or was it a conditioned response ? " Give me a break

You caught me LL . I'm full of s....

I can't see how those angler surveys are even remotely accurate , especially lake anglers . I fished a lot this year out of Sandy ,caught a bunch and only saw the survey boat once and stopped to see them . I don't know about how the Salmon River surveys go .

The " these fish don't hit " ain't right. I've had I would say 50 king hookups the last month or so ( my landing percentage sucks though) on skien. More than a few have swallowed the hook . I also have had a good number over the years smash a J 13 rapala . Also fly fishing early Nov browns have had kings hit a woolly bugger pretty hard , and watched them do it .A lot of guys at the Oak fish skien off the wall successfully . So they don't hit is wrong . Sure there are an awfull lot of outlaws out there . So ticket them .Don't punish law following anglers . I really don't care about lake anglers and how they choose to fish .I use a lot of the same equipment . I find it funny that anglers that have all this high tech equipment have a problem with someone with a fly or centerpin outfit and waders . So I have an idea , let's close down the Salmon River from Sept to Nov for 3 years . With one caviat, A moratorium on all Salmon tournaments on Lake Ontario for the same length of time . You know ,shared sacrifice . Then 4 to 7 years from now we MIGHT, MIGHT, have a chance to catch kings that average 3 to 5 # bigger than we have now . Definitely not Worth it in my opinion. We have a great fishery with trophy fish , albeit not as big as they use to be . What a banner year this was . You are in hell if you land a 20# king and think it's disappointing . Some people are never satisfied .

That's 10 k of the biggest fish , with the biggest fish genes that never even get a chance to run the gauntlet. They didn't get dragged in by their tails , they get dragged in behind a boat at 2 .5 mph with hopes of doubles and triples with all the multiple lines and high tech equipment to add to the fun . Some might say that's disrespectful . So people in glass houses .......

You know , I was just thinking , cause that's what I do . They have these salmon tournaments most every weekend during the year at different ports of LO . These highly advanced big boats, and there are a lot of them , with the latest equipment with the best anglers fish for the biggest 4 salmon box for cash prices. These boats only keep the biggest salmon they catch . So all these multiple biggest fish kept, and there are a lot , are not available to run the rivers to pass on those big fish genes. If those biggest fish are kept early spring / summer , they are the ones that would be the biggest come late summer. In fact , it seems , that there is a direct correlation between king size and when the number of salmon tournaments exploded in the last 15 years . Something to consider , don't you think ?

Actually they would like you to believe that . But when stocking was cut , the destination stream stakeholders were crying about not having kings for people coming up to catch , so they gave ours to those sites .

From what i hear from the guys that use to pen rear the kings at Sandy creek , the Sandy fish were the biggest / healthiest of any in the South shore . Don't know how true this is or if you here is any scientific data on this but that's what I hear . So if that's the case , maybe all South shore kings should be reared at Sandy . That is if in fact you want the biggest king possible . And the downward trend in size directly coincides with the halt of pen rearing at Sandy . Makes sense doesn't it ?

Are we sure that these fish are sexually maturing as 2 year olds more than in the past ? Or are we mistaking smaller 3 year old kings for 2 year olds ? A few years back we were getting a lot of Jacks skien fishing .This year non so no far and I have landed so very good size fish .

Sorry LL , I don't see that going over very big with the charter and especially tournament guys .

I just looked at the Canadian summer derby results for this year . Their sizes were comparable to ours . I know every once in a while I see one that's maybe 35 # . That's not a whole lot bigger than our biggest derby winners . Caught some nice skien under a float kings this afternoon . Man do those fish fight . Amazes me the power these zombie fish have .

You don't know that for sure . Nobody does . That's pure speculation at this point . This year I saw more bait in the lake than I have in a long while . Probably since the early 90s . Let's have 5 years of that and then see what happens size wise . But I'm on board with Longline about the nutritional value of today's alwives compared to long ago . Not every big king gets dragged out by its tail so to speak . Some make it to the hatchery or naturally reproduce . So there should be a few bigger fish in our catch as a whole lakeside . I got a 27#and change I weighed J plugging a few weeks ago so there are some big ones out there . And my scale is very accurate. And we are comparing ourselves to Socialist Canada now ?

So arrest and fine heavily the violators . This everyone should pay for the actions of a few ain't right . Many of us fish legit in the streams . Probably more than most think. Yup , the outlaws are out there . Fine them . I really enjoy the thrill and change of trib fishing . So why should that not be available to those who would like to do that ? Fishing was lights out this year . What more do you want ?

These kings are far from worthless this time of year . I contend they are as hard to get to hit as anytime during the season . I have landed more than a few on a long rod and lite line and get fight great . Not like dragging one in on a 500 copper but fun just the same . Drive thru Pulaski Sun morning on the way home from the ADKs . An awful lot of money changing hands there . Excuse my spelling and grandma

This is great news . At least we know where they are coming from My guess the reason the fishing was so good was a good natural reproduction year and the increase in stocking 3 years ago . If this keeps up in those streams we should have reasonably good fishing in coming years .