Sk8man

Reel Doc Although it could be done on Youtube or with a Go Pro etc. the absolute best way to get the true gist of it is to watch in person someone experienced doing it because as I said the "nuances" or small things are critical to success. I did fail to mention that most folks use something to protect their fingers from the wire (often a thumb and forefinger cut from a pair of thick leather work gloves) because if you snag up on bottom or even have a large laker at the end you could potentially severely cut or even lose a finger from the wire cutting. It is a technique done totally by hand without any reel etc. The slack in the wire is taken up automatically by the spring (or gear) inside the box. So as you change depths the victrola or A& S reel roll the wire onto the spool for you. In the old days various things were used to manually wind up the wire onto while trolling, OR the wire was coiled on the floor of the boat trying hard not to kink the wire. Mike: It would be a lot of fun watching Bill do it wouldn't it (especially experiencing initial hit and then the "head shake" of a real big one

A few diehards like Frogger and Signalman on Seneca and there are still some on Cayuga, Keuka and Canandaigua. It is the one technique though that takes years to perfect with a lot of hands on experience and not because it is particularly "difficult" but rather the little nuances make all the difference in the world. Two people on the same boat doing it can appear to be doing about the same thing but with vastly different results, and the bottom characteristics felt through the wire are very important - so knowing the bottom very well where you are fishing is also a game changer. You troll at very slow speeds and usually on a diagonal from shore gradually letting out wire while feeling the bottom to know where the lure is. My grandfather did it on Seneca in the early 1900's from a rowboat

The Victrola is one option for jerking copper and another popular one is the A and S automatic reel which often used monel wire ( a silverish colored soft wire somewhat like copper in many respects but at least for me tended to kink and break more often than copper.

Bill It is mainly used for bottom fishing for Lake Trout. There are spring (s) (some have only one others have multiple usually two) inside that are wound up with a "key" to create tension on single strand copper wire to which either a somewhat heavy spoon with the fixed hook facing upward to avoid catching on bottom or snagging weeds, OR a small thing resembling a flatfish on a leader (Twin minnow). The spoon is dragged slowly along bottom all the while "feeling" the bottom. The Twin minnow is run close to bottom. The operator holds the wire between his thumb and forefinger and uses a jerking motion ( often 2 small jerks followed by a long one or the reverse of it) as the spoon drags along the bottom (hopefully on cobble so you can feel it better). Like wise the twin minnow is pulled usually slightly and just off bottom, but everyone has a little different technique and success may depend on minor things that are done and firsthand experience is probably more critical to this technique than anything else in fishing and closely relates to success. Sorry Bill I couldn't resist ( But I did make it in less than a thousand words) Oh I forgot..... any slack in the wire as you troll along is taken up automatically by the spool on the top of the victrola.

Good idea..... if the guy is there he has some beautiful victrolas

Kinda like asking for someone to give up the rights to their high producing goldmine.....just joking

There are always some Robins that stay around all winter and don't head for Florida. When they do come back though they are usually in large numbers when they return.

I fully agree the larger ones in that range are primarily females and they are the breeders. Usually when you fillet them much of their internal area is devoted to fish egg capacity so it may not have as much usable flesh as smaller perch anyway. I don't keep anything 13 inches and above unless it is dying. Perch are a vulnerable species because of their schooling behavior despite their prolific breeding. We need to conserve breeders and real small perch as well. I have seen people keep some that would look good in a fish bowl or aquarium and you'd probably need a microscope to see them on the dinner table.

Great spoons. A lot of money fish caught with them on a variety of setups.

Lets hope so Stan It would be nice to get some to hit A lot of new stuff to try anyway

Yes Stan mine are going to get a real good workout as soon as I can get the boat out of storage and especially during the derby. He nickel plates the before the gold or silver plating so these are really sturdy spoons with a great finish. The black nickel ones save me from painting spoons black too https://elmerhinckley.com

That is for each piece

Maybe that needs to be more specific.....some folks may be tempted to throw fishing buddies overboard

If there was a derby for them you'd have it won Mike

If anyone has the bottom running riggers down pat it is Frogger. He is my idol; especiially since he won the Seneca Derby last year

Once again, this has many answers and hopefully some of the guys will pipe in with their specific setups. When running fairly close to bottom I usually run about 3-4 ft from the weight with flashers, dodgers and fly or cowbells, and slow my speed to about 1.4 to 1.8 sometimes even less with current. A standard for spoon is about 12- 20 feet if run clean if without attractor and with attractor 6-8 ft. or so. Things are different if running a Spin Doctor as they go all over the place rotating so I don't use them near bottom. You'll want to check the specific setup out to see how it is operating at the speed you are going before sending it down. As far as the distance to the peanut or Spin n Glow from the cowbells it is worth experimenting with for your own purposes but as a rule I set mine about 18 inches to about 28 inches being the longest. The Hammerhead cowbells offer the least amount of resistance so you might want them instead of the older type metal ones for easier handling. Both the size # 4 and # 5 work well on Seneca but I most often use the #5's with bait rigs. Remember to set your release clip to tighter tension with cowbells or flashers etc. to avoid false releases.

Maybe some of ours?

Mark and I used to message back and forth in between his trucking trips and I hadn't heard from him in awhile or hadn't seen posts here for some time. Would have reached out if I had known.....a real loss to the LOU community So sorry to hear that and my condolences go to his family. He was an incredibly gifted and competent fisherman and openly shared his knowledge with the folks on LOU. May he rest in peace. Thanks for letting us know Andy.