Wire without tips or rollers?

[MadPerry]

I went on a charter recently and the captain was using wire on rods that had no twilli tips or rollers.  I asked him about it and he said it wasn't needed.  He said it is piano wire and they were typical trolling rods.  I haven't set up wire divers, just mono.  Everyone here seems to claim you must use a tip or rollers with wire.  Could someone clear this up? 

[Sk8man]

The usual or standard rigging methods involve 7 or 19 stranded stainless wire and the hardness of it and abrasiveness of the strands over time acts somewhat like a saw on the tip and guides of conventional rods that don't have specially hardened tips and/or guides. The 19 strand wire is reputed to get away from this but I haven't had first hand experience with it. Supposedly the wire is more rounded so there is less of an "edge" to it. The wire can also cut some soft metal in level wind mechanisms. I have for example some Penn reels from the past that have such grooves or cuts in the level winds because they were softer than the ss wire I had used... To get away from this roller tips or twilli tips are used to reduce friction on the tips and line guides as well as allow the wire to keep from kinking or bending abnormally (to a degree). One way to get around this is to use wire that is "softer" than the tip metal or line guides - monel and copper are such wire and there are others such as perhaps the piano wire (smooth not stranded). Another angle that is pursued is to make the tips and line guides from very hard metals or composites that have a hardness greater than that of the wire....titanium is one such metal but it is expensive to use in the manufacturing process so it is usually only seen in high end equipment. Specially manufactured (hardened) carbide composites or special ceramic materials and coatings are used in less expensive options - usually as inserts to the tips and guides.

Edited July 28, 2013 by Sk8man

[Just Fishin']

I run the regular eye until I see the end guide starting to break down and then I put a twili on. Never had a wire fail from anything other than operator error that caused a kink, so I dont think it has caused any harm doing it this way. The length of time you get on a regular eye before breakdown has varied dramatically from rod to rod.

Just my experience.

[BAZOOKAJOE]

I ran 7-strand on eagle claw rods with no twilli for two seasons before the eyelet failed. I never had an issue.

[King Slammin]

I'm on my 2nd season of shimano tdr rods using 19 strand torpedo wire with no signs of wear.

[MadPerry]

I'm on my 2nd season of shimano tdr rods using 19 strand torpedo wire with no signs of wear.

Impressive.  I like the sounds of this.  Given how often I can even get out, I should get several years out of that kind of rig.

 

Thanks guys for your responses.  Sk8man, maybe you should consider a trolling course!  On Canandaigua Lake, maybe.  Hard enough figuring that lake out...

[King Slammin]

I'm a weekend warrior so I'm only out once a week. If u charter or tourney fish twilly tip or roller may be a better option

[Sk8man]

Sk8man, maybe you should consider a trolling course!  On Canandaigua Lake, maybe.  Hard enough figuring that lake out...

  Yeah I guess I really "get into it" sometimes in the way of details ...but I hope it helps you out... Canandaigua is often a challenge but especially so this year with the die off etc.  All these lakes have their "ups and downs" or cycles and usually just when you think you have it dialed in everything changes but that it what offers the challenge and makes it fun. Best of luck to you fishing.

 

Les

[Big Dave]

Price of tip VS price of dipsie & flasher & fly & stuff & fish ,,,     Hmmmm!!

[Yankee Troller]

You don't need rollers or Twilli's. However, these with greatly reduce the resistance you feel from the wire going through the top guide. Especially, when the fish is at the back of the boat.

 

We've been running roller rods this year, and boy are they sweet when it comes to no resistance due to the wire going through the guides. Cons however, are a heavier action rod, and heavier weighted rod. They also aren't cheap.

[Big Dave]

Yankee you should check out the 7' fish Doctor roller dipsie rods.  One piece and a lot more fun to fish with.

[Sk8man]

Rick - To make you feel better about pricing on the roller rods I was at a tackle shop in Cape Cod last week and the cheapest roller rod was $279....They had a rod/reel combo set up with wire for $999   My own roller rods looked a lot better to me after that