Close the Salmon River?

[Yankee Troller]

It needs to happen until November 1st. People come from all over and make a joke of this fishery. The disrespect towards Salmon that have a fighting chance to reproduce, and the illegal number of under sized and over limit of Steelhead should piss off the trib anglers. Clearly, our DEC officers can't handle Salmon season on the South shore with the number of boots on the ground this state gives them, and the courts aren't delivering high enough fines to deter the shenanigans. It's been left alone for too long, and the **** show continues to grow.

 

At what point do the fish get a say in getting dragged backwards? Are we turning a blind eye so ONE town can survive on the South shore? What about the rest of the lake for the other 7-9mos?

Edited Monday at 01:29 PM by Yankee Troller

[LazyRiver585]

I agree something needs to be done. Not sure if closing it is the answer. I’m only worried if it closes: rednecks gonna redneck. It will disperse some of the trash our way in their search for new waters to rape and pillage. 

[LazyRiver585]

There’s a demand. If you take away one source, a new supply must be found.

[Yankee Troller]

1 minute ago, LazyRiver585 said:

There’s a demand. If you take away one source, a new supply must be found.

 

I agree, but there isn't a source like the Salmon River on the entire South Shore that produces fish naturally. Canada does it. The rest of the tribs on the South shore are warm water muck holes with no flow control.

[LazyRiver585]

You are 100% correct. None of these tribs SHOULD have any appeal or draw. But does it matter to some selfish unethical jerk off that just wants an excuse for a weekend away with the boys to get **** faced and be passed off as “tradition” or a “rite of passage”? 
The Salmon River needs some protection. Absolutely. We just need to be conscientious of possible blow back of the actions taken. 

[GAMBLER]

The salmon are managed for the lake, yet they are not protected to keep the lake fishery going.  The Salmon River is the highest natural reproduction tributary on the South shore, and we now depend on natural reproduction more than ever.  Why are we not protecting our resource?  Low water and big crowds = less natural reproduction.  Less natural reproduction = ****ty fishing on the lake. They do close one section, but a ton are yanked out before they hit the most fertile sections of the river and the hatchery.  

[HB2]

Every year , same topic . 

 

I was wondering when this would be brought up . 

 

 

[Yankee Troller]

23 minutes ago, HB2 said:

Every year , same topic . 

 

I was wondering when this would be brought up . 

 

 

 

 

I finally broke after countless FB post and YouTube videos laughing and joking about snagging Salmon, flossing Salmon, and Steelhead abuse. I used to snooze a lot of that from my feed, but I decided not to this year. It's absurd how bad people treat this fishery and these tribs. 

[rolmops]

If the Salmon River seasonal  craze is what keeps this town alive, then it had better get its act together.

There is one big problem with closing the river. The treaties with the 6 nations allow for fishing rights in this river and breaking yet another treaty is not something that can be done lightly. 

If the 6 nations council agrees to the closure things can be done , but not before.

Edited yesterday at 02:41 PM by rolmops

[LazyRiver585]

Absurd is an understatement of how it’s treated. Blatant disregard or give a damn. Low life trash ****. 
I’ve never been to 18mile or Burt but the videos are just disgusting. You will not even see me at the oak until deer season has started. And even then, that’s just default destination for me if most other things are blown or locked up later in the year. 
heartbreaking when you slowly have to witness demise of something you love. Almost powerless to stop it.

[GAMBLER]

Closing the Salmon River will never happen due to the financial impact of a relatively poor area.  The DEC does need to do more to protect the salmon for natural reproduction purposes since we rely on natural reproduction to support the majority of the salmon population now.  The Steelhead creel was cut in the lake because they are managed for the tribs and not the lake.  Shouldn't management of the king population be cleaned up in the tribs that support natural reproduction?  You want all your larger kings to survive, slap a maximum size limit and reduce the creel limit on Salmon River Kings.  

[HB2]

I dont condone or want to be part of what goes on up there . Or really any of the crowded tribs this time of year . But in reality it doesn't at all or very little  affect  lake or trib fishing . 

In fact in a round about way , it probably helps . I've seen the crazy videos . And I've also seen some videos from some that really make the Salmon river region and river fishing look guite spectacular and a destination .  Some that see that and have never been here will come to experience it . Which insures continued and maybe increased funding . Which is why little or no enforcement. 

 

The hatchery is going to get all the eggs it needs and more . We just came off a few banner years of king fishing.  Does  anyone think the state for one second is going to shut  down its crown jewel  and cash cow?

[GAMBLER]

2 hours ago, HB2 said:

I dont condone or want to be part of what goes on up there . Or really any of the crowded tribs this time of year . But in reality it doesn't at all or very little  affect  lake or trib fishing . 

In fact in a round about way , it probably helps . I've seen the crazy videos . And I've also seen some videos from some that really make the Salmon river region and river fishing look guite spectacular and a destination .  Some that see that and have never been here will come to experience it . Which insures continued and maybe increased funding . Which is why little or no enforcement. 

 

The hatchery is going to get all the eggs it needs and more . We just came off a few banner years of king fishing.  Does  anyone think the state for one second is going to shut  down its crown jewel  and cash cow?

It certainly does affect the king population.  Low water years, less kings make it to the more fertile upper stretches of the river.  Less fish spawning = less fish produced.  Do you remember the year the DEC couldn't get enough eggs because kings weren't making it to the hatchery?  Shutting it down is a pipe dream that isn't going to happen.  Adjusting creel limits and a maximum size limit would keep more fish in the system and ensure big breeders (better genetics) are able to spawn.  Again, if they are truly managing the kings for the lake fishery, manage them for the lake fishery.  None of us here (lake, trib or both) agree with the BS that goes on in the salmon run.  The disrespect for the salmon and the fishery is disgusting.  

[Kingfisher06]

Curious what this boards opinion is on the DSR stretch? Shut it down along with the rest of river? Enable adjacent landowners to emulate the DSR irregardless of owning both sides? Hire temp seasonal ECOs? 

[GAMBLER]

15 minutes ago, Kingfisher06 said:

Curious what this boards opinion is on the DSR stretch? Shut it down along with the rest of river? Enable adjacent landowners to emulate the DSR irregardless of owning both sides? Hire temp seasonal ECOs? 

Shutting down of the Salmon River to fishing during the salmon run will never happen.  They do shutdown the lower fly section some years. The Douglaston is patrolled by their own people that don't tolerate snagging.  Trout and Atlantic salmon are catch and release only.  The times I fished the Douglaston, I observed more sportsmen and less cavemen on the banks.  I would love to see them drop the salmon creel limit and protect the salmon population more.   

[TyeeTanic]

In Canada the Credit, Bronte and Bowmanville rivers remain open for fishing through the fall.

The Ganaraska River in Port Hope closes from Sep 1 to Oct 15 to let most of the salmon through.

I don't think the Ministry made the decision to close Ganaraska on their own. The Town has complained

of the fiasco created by some of the fishermen, leaving garbage everywhere, and fishing illegally.

The pressure from the town council ultimately worked to have the river closed for that period of time.

Fishermen find alternatives in the other rivers mentioned above.

 

I get that it's a sensitive period, and I think a closing rivers for a reasonable and fair period of time is called for,

but it has to be balanced.  People with boats take from the fishery year round ... those are females and males that

are taken away from the spawn cycle.  I get the fish are more vulnerable in the rivers, which is 100% true.  But to

take the opportunity away from ethical river fishermen, who pay just as much tax dollars as lake fishermen, but don't

have a boat ... I'm not sure that is fair.

 

I'm not saying I have a solution ... but any solution needs to be fair on those that can't afford a boat or to charter.

 

[LazyRiver585]

Start a go fund me to donate to dec for seasonal deputy eco’s. lol 🤷🏻

[GAMBLER]

16 hours ago, TyeeTanic said:

 

 

I get that it's a sensitive period, and I think a closing rivers for a reasonable and fair period of time is called for,

but it has to be balanced.  People with boats take from the fishery year round ... those are females and males that

are taken away from the spawn cycle.  I get the fish are more vulnerable in the rivers, which is 100% true.  But to

take the opportunity away from ethical river fishermen, who pay just as much tax dollars as lake fishermen, but don't

have a boat ... I'm not sure that is fair.

 

I'm not saying I have a solution ... but any solution needs to be fair on those that can't afford a boat or to charter.

 

The NYSDEC manages the salmon, browns and lake trout for the lake.  Steelhead are managed for the tributaries.  The number of kings taken out of the system in the lake is planned on and stocking levels are set with that number in the equation.  Closing the Salmon River is a pipe dream.  Pulaski would be in serious trouble without the revenue from the out of town and local fishermen (Can we call some of them fishermen?).  Closing certain stretches of the river would leave some areas for the guys to fish while protecting the important stretches of the river.  Come to the Salmon River in late September or early October and you will be amazed at how many guys are shoulder to shoulder on this river.  The fish don't stand a chance.  Go on YouTube and google the salmon river Pulaski NY and watch some of the videos.  Some of the videos show some pretty bad disrespect for our fishery.  

Edited yesterday at 12:19 PM by GAMBLER

[HB2]

Enough of this , managed for the lake ,managed for the stream . Theses fish are available to all in both at certain times of the year .Quite possibly the fish taken out of the Salmon river is also  factored into that equation also . It ain't like the fishing  isn't good or in fact great . Are 30 bite days not enough ? Desciptions of insane bite. , bloodbath , couldn't keep rods in the water not enough ?  Some years are bad . That's the way it goes. 

 Considering how and what equipment, and its getting more advanced by the day ,  we use in the lake , I living in a glass house,  won't throw stones 

 

 

 

My guess is that what goes on up there has been discussed at length  by all parties , including TU, guides , tackle shops, lodging etc . And a policy on how to deal with the craziness has been established . And I think it is for law enforcement to stand down . Write a ticket once in a while to show they are there . To not scare the tourist dollars from coming back . Because law enforcement could have a field day writing tickets.  . 

[TyeeTanic]

3 hours ago, GAMBLER said:

The NYSDEC manages the salmon, browns and lake trout for the lake.  Steelhead are managed for the tributaries.  The number of kings taken out of the system in the lake is planned on and stocking levels are set with that number in the equation.  Closing the Salmon River is a pipe dream.  Pulaski would be in serious trouble without the revenue from the out of town and local fishermen (Can we call some of them fishermen?).  Closing certain stretches of the river would leave some areas for the guys to fish while protecting the important stretches of the river.  Come to the Salmon River in late September or early October and you will be amazed at how many guys are shoulder to shoulder on this river.  The fish don't stand a chance.  Go on YouTube and google the salmon river Pulaski NY and watch some of the videos.  Some of the videos show some pretty bad disrespect for our fishery.  

Yup, just saw some videos. That looks just the same as Bowmanville. There's a lot of congestion.

One thing though, these fish are smart. A lot of them only move at night. I've seen it with my own eyes ... dawn hits, things get darker, and they start coming in from the mouth.

 

[GAMBLER]

19 minutes ago, HB2 said:

Enough of this , managed for the lake ,managed for the stream . Theses fish are available to all in both at certain times of the year .Quite possibly the fish taken out of the Salmon river is also  factored into that equation also . It ain't like the fishing  isn't good or in fact great . Are 30 bite days not enough ? Desciptions of insane bite. , bloodbath , couldn't keep rods in the water not enough ?  Some years are bad . That's the way it goes. 

 Considering how and what equipment, and its getting more advanced by the day ,  we use in the lake , I living in a glass house,  won't throw stones 

 

 

 

My guess is that what goes on up there has been discussed at length  by all parties , including TU, guides , tackle shops, lodging etc . And a policy on how to deal with the craziness has been established . And I think it is for law enforcement to stand down . Write a ticket once in a while to show they are there . To not scare the tourist dollars from coming back . Because law enforcement could have a field day writing tickets.  . 

The management strategies were put in place by the DEC.  This is what told us when they changed the steelhead regs in the lake.  If that's how they want to manage the fishery, they should stick to the plan.  Law enforcement wasn't told to stand down.  There is a lack of ECO's in the DEC.  It has been this way for years.  There are only a couple ECO's in each county.  Tough to cover everywhere when multiple big seasons are going on at once.  Next time you see illegal activity on Sandy, call the DEC and see how long it takes for them to respond.  Like everywhere, they are understaffed.  According to the DEC website, there are currently 176 ECO's (there are more investigators and supervisors on top of the ECO's) for 62 counties (less than 3 per county average) in NY state. 

[GAMBLER]

Scenarios like this really help the kings get upstream…..

[HB2]

DEC could clean that river up in a week . If it wanted to . Send Game Wardens , Troopers and Sheriffs from all over the state , and write tickets till their fingers fall off . But they won't . 

 

 

There was a beat down on steelhead in the lake this summer . And we all know the mortality rate of released steelhead . Why are lake fisherman targeting the trib guys steelhead in the lake ? 

Edited 22 hours ago by HB2

[LongLine]

Just saw a video yesterday of a couple fishing the River.  He hooked a King, she grabbed what appeared to be an 8ft net and swung like a tennis racket then fell on her butt.  He brought the fish back toward shore and she tried to grab it by the tail. Fish wiggled and she began wrestling with it and it ended up back in river.  Was HILARIOUS!  Too bad there was no audio! 

[LazyRiver585]

Let’s not turn this thread into something it isn’t… 

the whole point is to bring awareness that at a very significant/unique/important tributary where state funded initiatives to help preserve our fishery as a whole (for trib and lake guys alike) has been, and will continue to be, extremely abused. 
sitting back and turning a blind eye is almost unbearable these days. 
talking time is done. Action is needed. What can we do? 
that’s what we trying to figure out together. Not go tit for tat