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chinook35

Sportsman ? Not so much

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Not a peep from the sunset police on this thread? Hmmmmmmm


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After so many fish and game violations in NYS, don't you lose your license for fishing or hunting? 

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The "sin" here is he did it for money, not for feeding his family in a legal manner.


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Greed is one of life's most evil diseases!!

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I think it is the irony of all irony that it is illegal to use bait but there are shelves of it every year at all of the hunting supply stores.  I would be curious to know how much tax revenue comes from these sales that are so illegal and to some unethical.  Other ironic part is that legislation from state to state is inconsistent.  I am only pointing out the irony - I have no strong feelings because I don't know the man and to my knowledge have never crossed paths with him.  It seems like he has a lot of people who do know him and that he is not well liked.  If you are willing to do the crime you should be willing to do the time.  It is kind of sinister that he is making money off from illegal activities.

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Seems like if this is first offense it's a bit more than a slap on the wrist, but not nearly enough.   This isn't a violation in my eyes this is out and cheating for profit.  Apparently fair chase isnt part of his skill set which makes me wonder if this is the tip of the iceberg with bill saiff outdoors.  Once a cheater always a cheater.... none of us are perfect, but I find this disgusting.  

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First I know what he did is illegal & wrong. Second, I have never met the man & have nothing to gain or lose here. I have watched videos on YouTube. I know I'm going to tick some guys off here but there are several different practices that I think are done regularly by guides & members that are questionable at best. Does anyone think, throwing back skippers & other fish that have been dragged or mortally injured during the fight, that we know are dead or going to die , to avoid use in creel count, is OK? We all know it happens regularly as Captains & weekend warriors run through skippers mixed with juveniles to get clients & themselves fish for the "cooler"! Does keeping fish that are hooked outside of the mouth when they swiped at a bait & missed OK as well? How about the guys that regularly sell their catch? OK TOO? Does planting acres of corn,soy beans, clover,turnips & setting blind or shooting house at the edge of these fields really anything other than hunting over a large bait pile? This guy cut corners & cheated for $! But it happens to some extend daily by some of your friends & colleagues every day! His actions are public knowledge & still has pending actions & consequences  in court. So while I don't condone his actions, I don't think this guy deserves the wrath of this site either! JMO

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2 minutes ago, dmd113 said:

First I know what he did is illegal & wrong. Second, I have never met the man & have nothing to gain or lose here. I have watched videos on YouTube. I know I'm going to tick some guys off here but there are several different practices that I think are done regularly by guides & members that are questionable at best. Does anyone think, throwing back skippers & other fish that have been dragged or mortally injured during the fight, that we know are dead or going to die , to avoid use in creel count, is OK? We all know it happens regularly as Captains & weekend warriors run through skippers mixed with juveniles to get clients & themselves fish for the "cooler"! Does keeping fish that are hooked outside of the mouth when they swiped at a bait & missed OK as well? How about the guys that regularly sell their catch? OK TOO? Does planting acres of corn,soy beans, clover,turnips & setting blind or shooting house at the edge of these fields really anything other than hunting over a large bait pile? This guy cut corners & cheated for $! But it happens to some extend daily by some of your friends & colleagues every day! His actions are public knowledge & still has pending actions & consequences  in court. So while I don't condone his actions, I don't think this guy deserves the wrath of this site either! JMO

Yes and No. Creel limit is that now I don't throw the fish back unless they are undersized. Whether they live or not it is Illegal to keep undersized fish. Rules are rules and bending them is the same as breaking them. I'm sorry sitting on the edge of a food plot is completely different than dumping a pile of corn in front of your deer stand/blind. The timing of the year contributes to the food plot and whether deer will want to visit based on the forage. I think he should be held accountable just as much as anyone else. No one should get off easy pulling that kind of crap.

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5 hours ago, Chas0218 said:

Yes and No. Creel limit is that now I don't throw the fish back unless they are undersized. Whether they live or not it is Illegal to keep undersized fish. Rules are rules and bending them is the same as breaking them. I'm sorry sitting on the edge of a food plot is completely different than dumping a pile of corn in front of your deer stand/blind. The timing of the year contributes to the food plot and whether deer will want to visit based on the forage. I think he should be held accountable just as much as anyone else. No one should get off easy pulling that kind of crap.

Chas0218 I get what you're saying but  HARVESTING ALL BUT THE TEN ROWS OF CORN IN FRONT OF YOUR STAND IS PRETTY MUCH THE SAME THING AT LONGER RANGE! HUNTING GEESE WHERE BEATERS CHASE & FLUSH THE FLOCK AFTER THEY HAVE LANDED IN FOOD PLOTS, TO FLY OVER SHOOTING PITS? I'm talking about the entire LOU membership. Do they all follow the law to the letter? I think not.  MY TAKE IS THE LAW HANDLES IT! SHOULD WE POST OTHER MEMBERS DWI'S OR ANY OTHER CRIMINAL ACTS ON HERE? No we shouldn't & that's not what the site is here for. JMO

Edited by dmd113

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First I know what he did is illegal & wrong. Second, I have never met the man & have nothing to gain or lose here. I have watched videos on YouTube. I know I'm going to tick some guys off here but there are several different practices that I think are done regularly by guides & members that are questionable at best. Does anyone think, throwing back skippers & other fish that have been dragged or mortally injured during the fight, that we know are dead or going to die , to avoid use in creel count, is OK? We all know it happens regularly as Captains & weekend warriors run through skippers mixed with juveniles to get clients & themselves fish for the "cooler"! Does keeping fish that are hooked outside of the mouth when they swiped at a bait & missed OK as well? How about the guys that regularly sell their catch? OK TOO? Does planting acres of corn,soy beans, clover,turnips & setting blind or shooting house at the edge of these fields really anything other than hunting over a large bait pile? This guy cut corners & cheated for $! But it happens to some extend daily by some of your friends & colleagues every day! His actions are public knowledge & still has pending actions & consequences  in court. So while I don't condone his actions, I don't think this guy deserves the wrath of this site either! JMO

Saiff absolutely deserves the wrath of this site and every law abiding sportsman in the US. He has betrayed his honor and deserves any and all discipline that the federal and state courts deem appropriate. We , as sportspeople , need to send a message that this is unacceptable behavior. Boycott his sponsors and his business


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The scum bag advertises on his web site that he is an "ambassador" of waterfowling.  I live in a state that allows baiting for deer .  I don't do it not will I put a client in a stand that has been baited for deer. 25 acre food plots are not the same as  a trough full of corn in the middle of a water hole for ducks. The guy is a hack. His stupid you tube shows are geared towards weekend warriors and contain hours of editing to make it look like he is the lakes  best fisherman. He goes to the west end for spring kings where Stevie Wonder can go and box out in an hour and then bull****s that he is outside of Henderson. The landscape in the background doesn't lie. Him and his band of idiots in his "fleet" make a living off people that know no better. I am even more upset by the harvesting of illegal birds. The guy is an a#$ and there should be no excuses made. It is my hope that when he appears in federal court that he sees jail time.

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31 minutes ago, chinook35 said:


Saiff absolutely deserves the wrath of this site and every law abiding sportsman in the US. He has betrayed his honor and deserves any and all discipline that the federal and state courts deem appropriate. We , as sportspeople , need to send a message that this is unacceptable behavior. Boycott his sponsors and his business


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Then you feel any member should be fair game? DWI, domestic dispute?  Because this sounds personal!

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Plus his vids are laughable and gives us hours of laughter on our boat. Neutral  Black Forward Neutral back red back forward rod up rod down forward  .... for crying out loud it is a freaking lake trout that fights like a wet sock it isn't a white Marlin.  I have put 350 pound tuna on deck with a novice fisherman fighting the fish on stand up gear and did not need to perform the same amount of boat work that moron needs to net a 10 pound laker

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49 minutes ago, GlassWater Outdoors said:

The scum bag advertises on his web site that he is an "ambassador" of waterfowling.  I live in a state that allows baiting for deer .  I don't do it not will I put a client in a stand that has been baited for deer. 25 acre food plots are not the same as  a trough full of corn in the middle of a water hole for ducks. The guy is a hack. His stupid you tube shows are geared towards weekend warriors and contain hours of editing to make it look like he is the lakes  best fisherman. He goes to the west end for spring kings where Stevie Wonder can go and box out in an hour and then bull****s that he is outside of Henderson. The landscape in the background doesn't lie. Him and his band of idiots in his "fleet" make a living off people that know no better. I am even more upset by the harvesting of illegal birds. The guy is an a#$ and there should be no excuses made. It is my hope that when he appears in federal court that he sees jail time.

You are missing my point! At the beginning of my post I clearly stated what he did was wrong! I don't condone what he did. If I read correctly it will cost him $15000 total  $5000 fine+ $10000 donation to waterfowl charity & 2 years no waterfowl hunting. While still facing possible further court actions. Not the death penalty but  $15000 isn't weekends doing public service. LOU isn't about airing "grievances" or personal attacks! But I will ask you the same question.Do you feel any member should be fair game? DWI, domestic violence dispute.. etc ?  Wife beater vs poacher? Who's worse? Because this also sounds personal!

Edited by dmd113

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41 minutes ago, dmd113 said:

You are missing my point! At the beginning of my post I clearly stated what he did was wrong! I don't condone what he did. LOU isn't about airing "grievances" or personal attacks! But I will ask you the same question.Do you feel any member should be fair game? DWI, domestic violence dispute.. etc ?  Wife beater vs poacher? Who's worse? Because this also sounds personal!

He's supposed to be a professional and set examples to his clients that come to him to learn the tricks of the trade. He deserves everything he gets

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1 hour ago, dmd113 said:

You are missing my point! At the beginning of my post I clearly stated what he did was wrong! I don't condone what he did. If I read correctly it will cost him $15000 total  $5000 fine+ $10000 donation to waterfowl charity & 2 years no waterfowl hunting. While still facing possible further court actions. Not the death penalty but  $15000 isn't weekends doing public service. LOU isn't about airing "grievances" or personal attacks! But I will ask you the same question.Do you feel any member should be fair game? DWI, domestic violence dispute.. etc ?  Wife beater vs poacher? Who's worse? Because this also sounds personal!

I don't drink and drive and I fully believe anyone who does deserves extensive jail time. . I never raised my hand to a woman so yeah I would say they are all fair game and should be treated the same a a person that poached for profit. It isn't personal at all. I never met the idiot nor do I care to

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1 hour ago, fishmaster13184 said:

He's supposed to be a professional and set examples to his clients that come to him to learn the tricks of the trade. He deserves everything he gets

So answer the question! Is any member subject to the wrath of LOU members or just the ones you pick? I gotta figure rallying the troops to attack sponsorship may have repercussions! I don't think the site should be put in that situation. If you want to run a Facebook campaign go for it! JMO

Edited by dmd113

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1 hour ago, dmd113 said:

You are missing my point! At the beginning of my post I clearly stated what he did was wrong! I don't condone what he did. If I read correctly it will cost him $15000 total  $5000 fine+ $10000 donation to waterfowl charity & 2 years no waterfowl hunting. While still facing possible further court actions. Not the death penalty but  $15000 isn't weekends doing public service. LOU isn't about airing "grievances" or personal attacks! But I will ask you the same question.Do you feel any member should be fair game? DWI, domestic violence dispute.. etc ?  Wife beater vs poacher? Who's worse? Because this also sounds personal!

You are way way off base here.... and if read above is correct 8 fishing boats to his name x$2400 a weekend if all double booked then yea that's a weekend

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1 minute ago, bandrus1 said:

You are way way off base here.... and if read above is correct 8 fishing boats to his name x$2400 a weekend if all double booked then yea that's a weekend

Weren't you the guy who recommended a guy not become a charter Capt on this site because there was no $ in it? I don't agree with your math & attempt to count charter fees as all profit!We all know that they don't get rich on charters & $15000 isn't weekends picking up trash along the highway. This in addition to all legal fees & lost business!This isn't a death sentence but I believe this is a sizable penalty.

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Then you feel any member should be fair game? DWI, domestic dispute?  Because this sounds personal!

This is a sporting website , not a police blotter. And it is not personal in the context you infer. It IS personal in that I condemn his crime against the sport of wildfowling He gives us all a black eye.

 

If you think for one second that PETA fund for animals and every other anti hunting/fishing organization in the world isn't all over stories like these you are sadly mistaken. We need to condemn these actions or be seen as like minded criminals

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8 hours ago, dmd113 said:

First I know what he did is illegal & wrong. Second, I have never met the man & have nothing to gain or lose here. I have watched videos on YouTube. I know I'm going to tick some guys off here but there are several different practices that I think are done regularly by guides & members that are questionable at best. Does anyone think, throwing back skippers & other fish that have been dragged or mortally injured during the fight, that we know are dead or going to die , to avoid use in creel count, is OK? We all know it happens regularly as Captains & weekend warriors run through skippers mixed with juveniles to get clients & themselves fish for the "cooler"! Does keeping fish that are hooked outside of the mouth when they swiped at a bait & missed OK as well? How about the guys that regularly sell their catch? OK TOO? Does planting acres of corn,soy beans, clover,turnips & setting blind or shooting house at the edge of these fields really anything other than hunting over a large bait pile? This guy cut corners & cheated for $! But it happens to some extend daily by some of your friends & colleagues every day! His actions are public knowledge & still has pending actions & consequences  in court. So while I don't condone his actions, I don't think this guy deserves the wrath of this site either! JMO

1.  Food plots are legal. 

2.  Skippers are thrown back on my boat if injured only if they are not legal.  If they are short, they go back.  It is the law. 

3.  If a fish in my boat is not going to make it, it goes in the cooler.  There is always someone that I can find to take the meat (yes even lake trout).

4.  Guys that sell there catch, if done legally (commercial license and following the law) I have no problem with it. 

 

I have a problem with guys breaking fish and game laws.  It is bad for all of us.  This is just another slap on the wrist by a judge for game violations.  When is NY gonna step up and take fish and game violations seriously.  The state could make a fortune off of the illegal activities that go on in this state!  He deserves more than a slap on the wrist. 

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