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Rods per person on the boat?


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Was at the Niagra Fishing Show this weekend and someone inferred the number of rods per person on the boat was changed from 3 to 4. Anyone hear anything of this? Always thought it was 3 rods per person on a boat.

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Reg's still says 3

 

  • An angler may operate no more than 3 lines with or without a rod.
    • Each line is limited to not more than 5 lures or baits or a combination of both.
    • Each line shall not exceed 15 hook points in any combination of single, double or treble hooks.
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Rod limits make no sense to me. If you have a creel limits set in place for what reason does a rod limit exist? Anglers got the state to go from 2 to 3 many years ago, but it should have been 2 to infinity in my opinion.

Edited by Yankee Troller
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There's something being discussed in state of Michigan about selling additional license/stamp so angler could troll additional rods on Michigan great lakes. Dont know any other details other than it would be specific to Michigan great lake waters if it gets beyond discussion. Michigan has shoreline on all great lakes except Ontario and supposedly extra license/stamp funds would be earmarked for the fisheries use.  Couldn't find the thread with info so I might be dreaming this up?

Found it.

https://www.thesouthend.org/index.php/forum/the-watercooler/6577-great-lakes-salmon-initiative-1-6-24?start=0

Edited by Queechylakepro
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I've gone 15 rounds before about this. 

 

To me it comes down to why are you fishing ? For most it's mostly C+R . It supposed to be sport fishing . Some days you get them ,some you don't . I see pier guys with 3 rods stretch out for perch or whatever . So now 4 , or 10 . It's one in the LO tribs past the first bridge . I can't imagine it being more . 

 

Southern bass lake are getting ruined with the electronic and boat and bait advancement . I don't want that here. 

 

There should be some honor in the way we pursue the fish . 

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Remember when what we called open toed sneakers would pull up to make sure you didn’t run more than your limit of rods. Remember once having to pull my buddy’s kid out of the cuddy. 

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14 hours ago, HB2 said:

I've gone 15 rounds before about this. 

 

To me it comes down to why are you fishing ? For most it's mostly C+R . It supposed to be sport fishing . Some days you get them ,some you don't . I see pier guys with 3 rods stretch out for perch or whatever . So now 4 , or 10 . It's one in the LO tribs past the first bridge . I can't imagine it being more . 

 

Southern bass lake are getting ruined with the electronic and boat and bait advancement . I don't want that here. 

 

There should be some honor in the way we pursue the fish . 

 

There is no evidence of electronic, boat, or bait advancement hurting any southern bass lakes. Mainly, it's the older generation putting up a stink becasue they don't want to spend the money to purchase the new tech, or they simply don't want to move away from their ways of how to catch a fish. If anything, electronics are allowing people to take pressure off the "normal" fishing spots and target fish that were never targeted before. It's teaching people facts about fish behavior rather than the opinions of a few that were written about in various publications.

 

Crappie guys for many years have been spider rigging southern and mid west lakes and I haven't seen anyone complain about that. I'd assume becasue there is a respect for the fish and a limit in place for the fisherman on how many they can keep.

 

In todays world with so much competition in "other things" to grab peoples free time why not allow people to go out and be more successful on the water?

 

Other than your opinion, which I respect and I'm willing to debate with you on, you have provided no real reason for having a rod limit in place.

 

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There is no " evidence " but it sure is happening . Forward Facing Sonar has been a game changer  . And live screen  also . The fish now really have nowhere to hide . When the salmon enter the tribs by me I see guys with side scan Cruise the creek looking for fish . It takes the mystic out of the sport  to me . . The state has set a trib one rod limit.  So without any limits a guy can have 10 rods out? What about other guys that want to fish with limited shore space. ?

 

 

 

Age brings wisdom . I use to scoff at that . My real reason comes down to  ethics . We are sport fisherman , not commercial fisherman . 

 

What's next for hunting , Camara drones to scan the woods to find game ? So now we don't have to do the legwork ? 

 

All these electronics  take the expertise out of the sport ,and it is a sport . Some forget that . 

 

And yes I have electronics and will soon come and buy one from you . Only because mine stopped working. It antiquated but it did the job .  The electronics of today are expedientially better than when I started . And amazingly before , I caught a lot of fish . 

 

And to me it's not about money . 

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I'll be adding panoptix to my boat this year and I think it'll teach me something about fish behavior and, maybe, put a few extra fish in the boat.  It is sure to add a bit more excitement, especially if the fish arent biting.  I respect the opinion that this technology provides an "unfair" advantage.  At the end of the day I'm still out there to enjoy being on the water and spend time with friends and family.  Sadly, I do not get to spend as much time on the water as I'd like.  When I do, I enjoy my fishhawk, screens, throttle control, GPS trolling motor etc etc.  They make it easier to control some of the variables needed to put a bend in the rod.  You still need to know how to run gear and make everything work which tech wont do for you. Really think that realtime sonar is different than putting on a driven hunt with a drone with a thermal cam.

 

We desperately need more outdoorsmen and women and need them to vote.  I think we should consider cutting folks some slack if there is a  disagreement with techniques used. (within reason of course)

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why do ice fisherman get to run 7 rods/tip ups each and boat fisherman can only run 3???you get a small group of ice fisherman together on a smaller lake and they can take up the whole lake with 7 tip ups each and pretty much screw anyone else looking to fish that body of water.whether you run 6 0r 12 rods on a boat doesnt effect any other boat fishing.seems to me the law is backwards.

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There is NO LIMIT on RODS.  The limit is on LINES.  The reason it is on lines is simply because you do not need a rod to catch a fish in New York State.  Growing up on Port Bay, our neighbor's grandfather (from the "old county") used to sit on his dock with a hand line.  I can remember him hand-lining a Northern Pike in! (was amazing) There's also a thing called the Seth Green rig, where a real Seth Green uses a winch to reel in a weighted cable with multiple hooks attached to it.  (A slider attaches to your fishing line, not the downrigger cable.)

 

The hook and point rules (quantity and size) are there for multiple Alabama rigs (umbrella) and gang hook snagging or foul hooking (incidental or not) 

 

Also, if you read the DEC definitions of "angling", it requires the use of a net to complete the landing of the fish.  Tip-ups are explicitly classified as not angling in the definitions which is why they have different regs.

 

What we call the "3 rod rule" was initiated and lobbied for by Big-O recreational fishermen to help them catch Salmon and was supported by many charters.  (I know because I initiated the petitions) The logic behind it was simply that Great Lakes fish could be above, in, or below the thermocline at any given time which was difficult to cover at the time with only 2 rods while trolling unless you had multiple persons on board.  It was felt that the 3rd rod could help more fishermen be successful hence more guys would return to the fishery and word would spread throughout the countryside. which could entice others.  The bottom line being potential for more license sales and help promote Big-0 fishing which would benefit local communities. i.e. bait shops, motels, launches, camp sites, gas stations, restaurants and even charters, etc.  

 

Tom B.

(LongLine)

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12 hours ago, LongLine said:

Creel limit is how many a fisherman can keep.  Not how many a fisherman can catch.  (Which opens the door to many questions)

good point.

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Exact wording on the regs makes a huge difference too. As far as the Seth Green rigs go the old regs regarding the number of rods stated that a maximum of two rods per person could be run and a maximum of 15 hook points. It didn't specify the number of lines. We changed trebles out to singles and ran 15 lines per rod. If you had two people in the boat you could run 60 spoons that way (15 per rod). Not many folks ran all 60 but there were various combinations run e.g. 7 or 10 leader rigs. It was at a time at least on Seneca when the average trout caught per hour was in the 4-6 hr. range (per the angler diaries) so it wasn't a big deal. They then added the max of 5 lines per rod and 15 points per line and that ended that practice.

Edited by Sk8man
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16 hours ago, LongLine said:

There is NO LIMIT on RODS.  The limit is on LINES.  The reason it is on lines is simply because you do not need a rod to catch a fish in New York State.  Growing up on Port Bay, our neighbor's grandfather (from the "old county") used to sit on his dock with a hand line.  I can remember him hand-lining a Northern Pike in! (was amazing) There's also a thing called the Seth Green rig, where a real Seth Green uses a winch to reel in a weighted cable with multiple hooks attached to it.  (A slider attaches to your fishing line, not the downrigger cable.)

 

The hook and point rules (quantity and size) are there for multiple Alabama rigs (umbrella) and gang hook snagging or foul hooking (incidental or not) 

 

Also, if you read the DEC definitions of "angling", it requires the use of a net to complete the landing of the fish.  Tip-ups are explicitly classified as not angling in the definitions which is why they have different regs.

 

If you reread that definition, you'll note the word "includes", and the absence of the word "requires."  The definition allows you to use the net, just as you are allowed to use a gaff if you are icefishing, but it in no way requires you to use a net.

 

As to 7 ice fishing lines, they are stationary, they cover the spot they are in, and that's it.  The boat trolling covers hundreds of such spots per hour.  I want to see the lake where a small group of icefishers can monopolize the whole lake with tip ups. 

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When there was debate about going to 3 rods I predicted at some point it will not be enough and it would be proposed to be 4 or now more . 

 

 

I saw a decked out bass boat in the creek with 10 rods  killer trolling motor , power poles and 4 12" screens , 2 bow and 2 helm . As I was  rowing my 12 ft row boat with an anchor from my kids weight set on a 15 ft rope and a few rods , I asked myself , shaking my head smiling  ,is this what you need to catch a 18 " bass ? 

 

One of you guys will get electric reels for your 600 ft copper and a lot of you will just have to get them . When the rod goes off , leave it in the holder and push a button to bring it in . All while holding your phone on Facebook  

 

My age is a detriment.  I saw what it started  and where it is now . And fear where it's going . 

Edited by HB2
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On 2/21/2024 at 4:14 PM, Yankee Troller said:

Rod limits make no sense to me. If you have a creel limits set in place for what reason does a rod limit exist? Anglers got the state to go from 2 to 3 many years ago, but it should have been 2 to infinity in my opinion.

it comes down to more people who don't normally get limits. with the extra rod, they have a better chance of getting more fish or even limits that they wouldn't otherwise catch. when they set limits they factor in that most people don't get their limit. after time if more people are getting more fish the limit will have to be reduced to make sure they aren't overharvested. if the population of the fish numbers are stable then they should be left alone. but if the numbers are rising then an extra rod wouldn't hurt anything for a while. but if the numbers are reduced to low then something would have to be done.

 

I remember Lake Erie had so many walleye they didn't have a limit for years. but as more fishermen became aware of the fantastic walleye fishing and started fishing Erie. as the fishermen grew in numbers the amount of fish was reduced to the point they had to put a limit on the fish. the limit has been anywhere from 10 to 4 walleye on Erie just since I started fishing on Erie.

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Semantics can be argued all day long.  I read the wording "and includes" to mean requires.  Yes, I realize you can land a bass via thumb in mouth (if you don't mind hooks in your fingers)'and you can tail a King.; (If you don't mind getting splashed.) and you can drag a fish to shore then scoop it out with your hands. With those in mind and the advent of the Boga type grip, maybe this reg should be re-written/clarified. 

 

Use and possession of Gaff and Gaff hooks is explicitly prohibited on fresh water in New York State, in the general angling regulations.  Maybe regs say you can use them with tip-ups/downs somewhere, but I'm not aware of it. Tip-ups/downs are not considered angling. 

 

I've seen those 2nd mortgage boats too.  

$100K for the boat

$45K for the power plant

$50K for electronics

$15K in rods/gear

$85K for the truck to haul it all

$2K for insurance

for what?  One has to win a lot of tournaments to pay that back.  

 

With old age comes wisdom and sometimes senility.

 

 

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"Use and possession of Gaff and Gaff hooks is explicitly prohibited on fresh water in New York State, in the general angling regulations.  Maybe regs say you can use them with tip-ups/downs somewhere, but I'm not aware of it. Tip-ups/downs are not considered angling."

It's in the regs but it only applies to ICE FISHING.

Edited by Sk8man
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21 hours ago, LongLine said:

Semantics can be argued all day long.  I read the wording "and includes" to mean requires.  Yes, I realize you can land a bass via thumb in mouth (if you don't mind hooks in your fingers)'and you can tail a King.; (If you don't mind getting splashed.) and you can drag a fish to shore then scoop it out with your hands. With those in mind and the advent of the Boga type grip, maybe this reg should be re-written/clarified. 

 

Use and possession of Gaff and Gaff hooks is explicitly prohibited on fresh water in New York State, in the general angling regulations.  Maybe regs say you can use them with tip-ups/downs somewhere, but I'm not aware of it. Tip-ups/downs are not considered angling. 

 

I've seen those 2nd mortgage boats too.  

$100K for the boat

$45K for the power plant

$50K for electronics

$15K in rods/gear

$85K for the truck to haul it all

$2K for insurance

for what?  One has to win a lot of tournaments to pay that back.  

 

With old age comes wisdom and sometimes senility.

 

 

Use of Gaffs

Use or possession of gaffs or gaff hooks is prohibited when fishing in freshwater, including the Hudson River upstream of the Mario M. Cuomo Bridge, except when ice fishing or while bowfishing.

 

That is directly copied from the Regulations.  I added the bold.  

 

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I should add that my gaff is piece of 1/2" dowel about 15" long with a 1/0 Siwash hook with the barb removed screwed onto one end, with about  4 feet of braided nylon I can step on in case I lose my grip on the dowel.  I carry it for Hemlock or Canadice, where I lost a nice brown once that had rolled in the leader and refused to come into the hole, but have not had opportunity to use it since (or even carry it out the last two winters.)   

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